France follows US script.

FluffyMcDeath

FluffyMcDeath

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Find some terrorists somewhere - invade to help the locals get rid of them - find out you have to stay. Mali.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Find some terrorists somewhere - invade to help the locals get rid of them - find out you have to stay. Mali.
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Gee, I wonder if the american hating frogs over there will act the same to their own gov as they acted towards the USA in the last decade.
 
redrumloa said:
Gee, I wonder if the american hating frogs over there will act the same to their own gov as they acted towards the USA in the last decade.
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The French haters of American war, you mean. Any Frenchman knows that this is clearly different from an American war because, for a start, it's French. Mali was being overrun by some nasty folks, but because Mali is an old French colony they have kept up "relations" with the government there so they could get themselves invited to come in to help out.
Of course, none of this would have been necessary if the French hadn't been so keen on helping with getting Gaddafi from that old French colony, Libya.

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FluffyMcDeath said:
For doing in Mali what the Soviets did in Afghanistan.
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Well that's a tricky statement to interpret coming from you. It's hard to believe you disapproved of the Soviets support of the ousting of the pro-Western Afghan government.

Also tricky because it's nothing at all like a full scale invasion. I think the French action in Mali is good for the people of Mali.
 
Glaucus said:
Well that's a tricky statement to interpret coming from you. It's hard to believe you disapproved of the Soviets support of the ousting of the pro-Western Afghan government.
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They came in to protect the Pro-soviet government from religious nutters. The pro-soviet government asked them to.

Also tricky because it's nothing at all like a full scale invasion. I think the French action in Mali is good for the people of Mali.
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The Soviet action in Afghanistan was probably good for the people of Afghanistan, at least the ones who weren't religious nutters especially the ones being funded by Saudi Arabia and Pakistan.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
They came in to protect the Pro-soviet government from religious nutters. The pro-soviet government asked them to.
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You mean the pro-Soviet government that Soviets helped get into power? The same pro-Soviet government that violently overthrew the prior government and then proceeded to hunt down and execute all dissidents and then also started executing and overthrowing it's own ranks? By the time the Soviets invaded almost all the top ranking revolutionaries were killed off by co-revolutionaries. It turns out that the communist coup wasn't all that popular because they themselves were a bunch of nutters. And the Saudi and Pakistani religious nutters didn't get involved until after the Soviet invasion Fluffy. Al-Qaida is believed to have been founded in 1988, long after the Soviet invasion.

So no, the parallels you're trying to draw between Mali and Afghanistan are completely invalid as the Soviets didn't rush in to repel an Islamist incursion as the French did in Mali.
 
Glaucus said:
You mean the pro-Soviet government that Soviets helped get into power? The same pro-Soviet government that violently overthrew the prior government and then proceeded to hunt down and execute all dissidents and then also started executing and overthrowing it's own ranks?
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The French, like all the colonial powers, never really let their old colonies chose their own governments.
Prior to 1973 Afghanistan had pretty good relations with the Soviets because, while they had initially asked the west for aid to modernize, the west rebuffed them, so they turned to the Soviets. The Soviets helped them modernize but there was a military coup in 1973 that began suppressing leftists and moving the country away from the Soviets. In 1978 the coup government was overthrown by another coup with the opposite alignment. Sure, there is a big power game going on as states try to retake (by subterfuge and force) old territories which they feel belong to them. All of which just helps to make the analogy tot eh French in Mali perfect. By the way - the folks in the Soviet Union were told that their boys had to go in to beat back Muslim Extremists - and it was true enough too, even if it was less than the full truth.
The truth is that no country anywhere throws huge sums of money and armour (and the potential exposure to intelligence gathering and political danger) without the expectation of a payoff.
Admittedly Mali is not much to look at - it's pretty much Sahara, but it butts up against the long time French "property" of Algeria (which is now between the French in Mali and the French backed Libya and the French Mediterranean and Algeria (like Libya) has oil but also gas, copper and other resources.
 
The fact that the French have financial incentive to be in Mali doesn't mean their goals are not aligned with the people of Mali. From what I can tell, the people of Mali were very happy to see the French military defeat the enemy the Malian army couldn't. You repeatedly make the argument that colonialists are bad, but I don't think it's an automatic thing. Sometimes it's good as in the case with Mali and bad as with the Soviets in Afghanistan.
 
Sometimes it's good as in the case with Mali and bad as with the Soviets in Afghanistan.
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It's good when your leaders say it's good, it's bad when your leaders say it's bad. You will be shown the specially selected news you require to agree. Other people's news will vary.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
It's good when your leaders say it's good, it's bad when your leaders say it's bad. You will be shown the specially selected news you require to agree. Other people's news will vary.
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I guess we can't all be smart enough to get our news from Russian propaganda websites.
 
Glaucus said:
I guess we can't all be smart enough to get our news from Russian propaganda websites.
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Only western ones (or what we often refer to as the media - steno pool for disseminating policy as "news"). Fox lies. So do all the rest (yes, including the Russian ones, I know). The mistake you seem to be making is that you think I trust any of them.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Only western ones (or what we often refer to as the media - steno pool for disseminating policy as "news"). Fox lies. So do all the rest (yes, including the Russian ones, I know). The mistake you seem to be making is that you think I trust any of them.
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So then we're both making the same mistake? You know, two people can know all the same facts and come to different conclusions.
 
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