How bad is the current US Health Care system?

FluffyMcDeath

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Well, at least this bad. Private insurers make profit when they deny claims. That's the bottom line.

On the other hand the current Obama plan has taken away the only effective option for controlling costs and providing care : single payer.

Meanwhile the US provides about 15 billion dollars a year in subsidies to Israel so that while they are killing Palestinians they are also enjoying state health care on the US taxpayers dime while the US taxpayer can't get the same thing.

It seems that health care is even enshrined as a right under the US written Iraq Constitution.
 
Out of interest how bad is it really?

Assuming you have no insurance....

For example, you have some red lumps on your arm. Does it cost money to visit the GP? Does it cost more if they prescribe you some drugs for it? How much if the doctor wants to take a blood test? How much if they want to refer you to the hospital for some kind of operation on the skin?
 
I have no how bad it is idea but get the impression that a few posters on here think there's little, if anything, wrong with it.
 
one problem is that it's over-complicated

I've freelanced my entire adult life so I don't understand insurance through an employer. you'll have to ask others for that info

frankly, I don't know how ANYONE can understand all that.

I don't like the way patients are generally handled.
this summer I spent way too much time driving my aunt to various doctors for tests and examination. My mom also has had a bunch of tests mostly to make sure things are working ok (and she's fine, btw)

the worse day we spent 6 hours - yup, not a typo, I said SIX freaking hours waiting, her getting three tests, waiting, waiting and waiting. How anyone thinks it's ok to ask an elderly, in pain person to put up with that shit is beyond me. heck, it took ME about three days to recover from that day and I'm not sick! It was one of those 90 degree hot days (over 32 Celsius). The waiting room was airconditioned and way too cold for me (i was in my shorts). my muscles get all tight if I sit in a cold room not moving for hours. So I stayed mostly outslde in the heat dehydrating. fun times (NOT)

the lame excuse from my aunts doctor is that one of their staff had not come in the office.
yeah, sure.
all they want is to get bodies in there so they can collect the medicare money.

screw them.
 
What I can tell you from my own current experience is this.

Being fat, and diabetic, I suffer from Sleep Apnea (most people who snore do as well). My diagnosis from a sleep study (a miserable experience) was "borderline critical" with me literally stopping breathing about 41 times per hour -- which causes the loud snoring.

There is a surgery available which normally alleviates the problem by removing the tonsils and trimming back a bit of the back of the throat to open the airways. I am told that while the surgery is very painful, it is not a silver bullet resolution to the problem. I happen to know at least two people that it did cure completely, but they're supposedly (again, according to the insurance company) in the "vast minority".

I also suffer from what I hesitate to call a phobia about things covering and/or touching my face. This is why -- even if it kills me -- I vastly prefer my half-helmet to the full-face that I reserve for rainy days. I told my doctor that under no circumstances will I be able to tolerate what equates to sleeping in a helmet with a face hugger attached to my face. This is known as a CPAP mask.

That being said, the glorious insurance company -- in their infinite stupidity -- has stated however that I *must* go the CPAP route for at least 6 months if not longer before they would even consider the surgery route.

So.. Being forced by the corrupt machine to go out and spend $2000 ($400 out of pocket) on a CPAP machine (that I was not given a choice of models, or prices, or pretty much anything but a mask), I have literally not slept for the past two days until about 6am when I apparently rip the mask off and fall asleep...

I asked the ENT doctor about the surgery, she said that if I paid for it, it would be $5000 - $7500. If they had to bill the insurance company, that price goes to $20k-$25k due to what she called "overhead". I also asked my GP about it and he explained that between the 4 doctors sharing his office, each with one RN, there were 31 additional trained professionals whose sole job was to file paperwork for the insurance companies.

Indeed, a few years ago when I didn't have insurance, I sliced the tip off my finger. Office visit? $25. On the 8th of June, I visited the doctor for my quarterly checkup, my co-pay was $15, but the amount billed to the insurance company -- just to walk in the door -- was $85.00...

Like most times, I saw the doctor about 3 minutes and he was off to another patient. I saw the nurse for maybe 4 minutes, and was completely in and out of the office within 15 minutes.

I guess I understand when -- due to insurance -- your overhead is about $1200 per hour (presuming $20 x 31 + $40 for the RN and $100 for the doctor himself plus the office space and materials). At the rate of $85 per visit and 4 visits per hour, I think they're making an absolute killing.

At this point, I can firmly state that anyone who approaches me with the blind Republican viewpoint against public health care can suck my schvanstika (sic).

It CANNOT get worse than it already is. The health care system in America is fucked up folks. In no other supposedly industrialized country on EARTH can a human being be lowered into poverty and bankruptcy by getting sick.. Sorry folks, but if you believe it can (short of collapse), then you're deluding yourself bought by ads placed by the very source of the problem (the medical and prescription lobbies).

Wayne
 
Wayne said:
So.. Being forced by the corrupt machine to go out and spend $2000 ($400 out of pocket) on a CPAP machine (that I was not given a choice of models, or prices, or pretty much anything but a mask), I have literally not slept for the past two days until about 6am when I apparently rip the mask off and fall asleep...

.. and oh yeah, forgot the best part. Before being forced to purchase said piece of shit device, I looked on the Web and the exact same device sold on the Web -- with shipping -- new with warranty -- is about $600 total, not the $2000 that will be billed to the insurance company or $400 out of pocket.

Here's the proof behind the pudding;
http://www.cpap.com/productpage-bundle/ ... undle.html

You have to toss in about $100 to $200 for a mask (which is personalized to each head) but still, better than the $2000 that will be billed to my insurance company. Trouble is, the insurance company won't allow you to buy online, even from a certified company.

You gotta love the corrupt bullshit that has become the American "health care" racket. If I could prove it, I'd put the whole damned lot in jail for racketeering.

Wayne
 
Wayne said:
At this point, I can firmly state that anyone who approaches me with the blind Republican viewpoint against public health care can suck my schvanstika (sic).

It CANNOT get worse than it already is. The health care system in America is fucked up folks. In no other supposedly industrialized country on EARTH can a human being be lowered into poverty and bankruptcy by getting sick.. Sorry folks, but if you believe it can (short of collapse), then you're deluding yourself bought by ads placed by the very source of the problem (the medical and prescription lobbies).

Wayne, I agree with your assertion that the system is screwed up. No question there. What I disagree with is Obama's desire and ability to make any true positive changes. Why take a broken system and break it far worse? Obama just wants to shift the profits.
 
I think Obama is simply trying to create a transition state to universal health care.
 
Glaucus said:
I think Obama is simply trying to create a transition state to universal health care.
... and I have yet to have anyone point out a reasonable argument against universal health care. Just me though.. Liberal that I am I guess.
 
Wayne said:
... and I have yet to have anyone point out a reasonable argument against universal health care. Just me though.. Liberal that I am I guess.

There is a Social Security office a couple miles from your house, go visit it some time to see how well it is run.

On a side note, I spent several hours there in 2006 and left with a nasty, nasty case of strep throat.
 
Wayne said:
It CANNOT get worse than it already is. The health care system in America is fucked up folks. In no other supposedly industrialized country on EARTH can a human being be lowered into poverty and bankruptcy by getting sick.. Sorry folks, but if you believe it can (short of collapse), then you're deluding yourself bought by ads placed by the very source of the problem (the medical and prescription lobbies).

What I find astonishing is that all this anti-social-healthcare talk is going on at the same time the US government is spending vastly more money on healthcare than any other country (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Inter ... 25_GDP.png - and that is in terms of %/GDP, not $/person).

The government spends a bewildering amount of money but it seems those of us with social health care get more for a much lower price.

My naive suggestion to fix things is, therefore, just stop spending all of that and duplicate a UK NHS. Sure there will be horrendous waste, bureacracy and mismanagement, but it'll be cheaper and overall you'll get better value.

Seriously though, where is all this money going and more importantly, under what guise is it going?

And why are all these protestors seemingly not bothered how much public money is already going on healthcare?
 
redrumloa said:
On a side note, I spent several hours there in 2006 and left with a nasty, nasty case of strep throat.

It's unlikely you got strep throat there unless you licked a door handle or something while you were there ;-)
 
redrumloa said:
There is a Social Security office a couple miles from your house, go visit it some time to see how well it is run.
After reading the above you think private industry does it any better? Of course not they simply do it with a 30% markup.

My stories --
Mom: Diagnosis breast cancer. Treatment: started 4 months later and only because she rode on the insurance provider. An unrelated shot she could buy from the drug store for $200. She could only have it from an approved Dr at $1,000 to the healthcare company. And no the insurance company wouldn't let her buy the meds and drive across town herself. That $200 would not be reimbursed. So she paid $45 copay and the healthcare company paid $955.


Self: We were billed for a pregnancy check from the hospital. The insurance rejected the claim. We filled out paperwork for the rejection. Turns out the insurance wanted to check that no duplicate provider existed. Even though they frickin' knew no 2nd insurance provider existed. They paid 3 bills around the same time asking the same question. One was a month after, one was a month before, and another was 2 months before.
In a similar timeframe a buyout of the company I worked for cancelled all insurance. They signed with a new provider. They refused to pay anything to the old provider. Even though the claim was due and during the time of coverage dancing about meant now the employer relationship was broken and the insurance company didn't have to pay.
Through the next -- YEAR & A HALF -- we worked on the, now ex-employer, and ex-insurance to pay a bill that they were liable for due to the agreement to pay for healthcare. After involving the Minnesota Attorney General the ex-employer finally paid the bill, in the form of a check to us. We agreed to the accept not the rate the hospital charged us but the rate the healthcare provider's previously agreed rates. This were about 40% less than the hospital was willing to charge us 'without healthcare'.
Now the dancing with the hospital began. After another 3 months worth of work and finally sending them the documentation of the entire episode (over 100 pages) they agreed for us to pay the lower rate of the provider.

I hate healthcare insurance companies. They provide NOTHING to the system. They charge extra to the system to move money around and deny payments. That's the industry we've allowed to be constructed.
 
smithy said:
It's unlikely you got strep throat there unless you licked a door handle or something while you were there ;-)

That rat hole had a tiny waiting area with improper ventilation. I had the fortune of getting the only open seat next to a guy hacking and gagging the whole time. There are no coincidences.
 
@faethor

I agree the system is screwed up and new regulations to keep abuses of private insurer's in check. The whole system is screwed up, but all the government is doing is attempting a cash grab and further erode liberties. The public plan will just replace a bad private system with a far worse public system. BTW, the doctors are in on the scam. Most of these bastards will refuse cash. As you mention overcharging insurance companies, this is why they will refuse cash.

BTW, you have heard of the "pentalty" for individuals not carrying insurance, right? How American is that? If I want to move out to a shack in Montana, live off grid and die off grid, who the hell is big brother to tell me I can't? Microchip implants here we come, hello mark of the beast.
 
redrumloa said:
I agree the system is screwed up and new regulations to keep abuses of private insurer's in check.
Meh! I don't believe for a second that Republican Representatives would agree to this. They'll sell this as government trying to control business and socialism too. Remember it was Republicans that outlawed Medicare from negotiating with drug companies. This results in high prices for patients. The other government care, VA, can negotiate and in return sees the lowest cost for medicines in the USA.

What regulation I'd agree to here: Medical Insurance companies - are all non-profits, salaries are capped, cannot deny any claim of proven treatment by a licensed doctor, woo woo (eg. acupuncture, massage, chiropratic) is not covered, all forms are the same for all companies.

The whole system is screwed up, but all the government is doing is attempting a cash grab and further erode liberties. The public plan will just replace a bad private system with a far worse public system.
Remember it is a Public Option. You can opt for private companies plans or the government plan. If the government plan is not attractive then no one signs up and it goes away.

IMO everyone should have medical care. Medical Insurance -- is simply a way to rake profits off of a medical system. Their job is to deny benefits to increase profits. If the profits go to the government or UHC's President who makes $100K/minute.... My choice is the government, at least I have some control, albeit indirect, over the running of the operation with my vote.

BTW, you have heard of the "pentalty" for individuals not carrying insurance, right? How American is that?
Actually I'd think the insurance companies would be for this. The uninsured are covered now in the USA. It's mandated that the system must cover the costs. In turn hospitals raise fees to cover the uninsured and it results in all of us paying it in higher insurance premiums as it's passed down the line. If we tooks the uninsured out of the system companies should, in theory, see higher profits. The insurance companies keep their high rates and reduce their costs.
 
Wayne said:
What I can tell you from my own current experience is this.

Being fat, and diabetic, I suffer from Sleep Apnea (most people who snore do as well). My diagnosis from a sleep study (a miserable experience) was "borderline critical" with me literally stopping breathing about 41 times per hour -- which causes the loud snoring.
I ran across this. 10% weight loss improves sleep apnea "The greatest benefit of weight loss was found in males, those with the most severe sleep apnea and those who lost the most weight."

Not trying to be preaching... Just letting you know cuz we care.
 
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