Iran court convicts Christian pastor convert to death

[Dammy]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/02/22/iran-court-convicts-christian-pastor-convert-to-death/

A trial court in ​

Iran​

has issued its final verdict, ordering a Christian pastor to be put to death for leaving​

​

Islam​

​

and converting to​

​

Christianity​

, according to sources close to the pastor and his legal team.​

Supporters fear Youcef Nadarkhani, a 34-year-old father of two who was arrested over two years ago on charges of apostasy, may now be executed at any time without prior warning, as death sentences in Iran may be carried out immediately or dragged out for years. It is unclear whether Nadarkhani can appeal the execution order.​

​

​

Peaceful religion at work. ​

 

[FluffyMcDeath]

That's what happened to Christians under the Romans too. They seem to have done quite well - martyrs, you know.

But I always wondered why the being that made the entire universe in six days needs human beings to carry out his divine punishments for him. Wouldn't it make a lot more sense to let God do the appropriate punishing? Being omniscient as well you'd get a much lower false conviction rate.

Now, this is an apostasy case and the crime is not being Christian but leaving Islam. To be fair, if he had never been a Muslim and always been a Christian they wouldn't be executing him. On the other hand, orthodox Jews for example just hate Christians on principle. However, they equally hate Muslims - so perhaps you are and orthodox Jewry are in partial agreement.

Personally I think all religions are equally nuts - but I guess I don't need to tell you that.

 

[Dammy]

That's what happened to Christians under the Romans too. They seem to have done quite well - martyrs, you know.

But I always wondered why the being that made the entire universe in six days needs human beings to carry out his divine punishments for him. Wouldn't it make a lot more sense to let God do the appropriate punishing? Being omniscient as well you'd get a much lower false conviction rate.

Dunno. How about you flying to Iran and see the judges in person and try to convince them of your logic?

 

[FluffyMcDeath]

Dunno. How about you flying to Iran and see the judges in person and try to convince them of your logic?

That kind of logic doesn't work on the kinds of people that send money to religious radio stations either. Just because an idea is patently and obviously stupid doesn't mean that people will let themselves see it that way.

 

[Glaucus]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/02/22/iran-court-convicts-christian-pastor-convert-to-death/

​

​

Peaceful religion at work.

Listen, this has nothing to do with the religion. I don't like any religion, but I know enough to not blame the religion. The regime itself is using religion as a tool to control the people and this is just part of it. It's like when a mob member decides to become an informant, you can't allow that sort of thing so you take him out. Christians have done similar things such as the inquisition and burned people at the stake. Only difference is that the Europeans have struggled their way out of the churches grasps and it's power has been greatly reduced and that's why you don't see that sort of thing anymore. In other words, you can thank the "progressives" for the fact that modern day Christianity is so liberal and tolerant.

 

[Dammy]

That kind of logic doesn't work on the kinds of people that send money to religious radio stations either. Just because an idea is patently and obviously stupid doesn't mean that people will let themselves see it that way.

Lot good that does that poor guy waiting on them to ass rape him before they execute him.

 

[Dammy]

Listen, this has nothing to do with the religion.

If it has nothing to do with Islam, why does Islam specifically call for executions of those who leave Islam? Sounds like it does have direct links to Islam to me. So why would you say it doesn't have anything to do with Islam?

I don't like any religion, but I know enough to not blame the religion. The regime itself is using religion as a tool to control the people and this is just part of it. It's like when a mob member decides to become an informant, you can't allow that sort of thing so you take him out. Christians have done similar things such as the inquisition and burned people at the stake. Only difference is that the Europeans have struggled their way out of the churches grasps and it's power has been greatly reduced and that's why you don't see that sort of thing anymore. In other words, you can thank the "progressives" for the fact that modern day Christianity is so liberal and tolerant.

No, I would say it would be a conservative to allow individual liberty to reign over religion that the centralized government has endorsed. Afterall, look at the Progressive's fanatical dedication to the Church of the State and their ultimate desire that we all must bow and worship for our daily existence. Wouldn't conservatives be defending the original religions vs the tyranny of exotic Christian religion that was being forced down their hick throats because the King (central authority) deems it best for them?

 

[Robert]

If it has nothing to do with Islam, why does Islam specifically call for executions of those who leave Islam?

Claiming Islam says this is like claiming Christianity specifically calls for executions for all sorts of trivial things.
In fact, as far as I'm aware, the Q'ran makes no such calls.
The Bible on the other hand.....
Not that you'd think that relevant.

Like Fluffy, I think all religions are stark-raving-bonkers, including Islam. However, this appears to me as nothing more than a thinly veiled display of "Christian = good; Jew = good; but Muslin = bad"
Or to put it another way, bigotry.

 

[faethor]

No, I would say it would be a conservative to allow individual liberty to reign over religion that the centralized government has endorsed.

This seems like a strange comment from the fellow who desires Catholic laws to be instituted within the central government. Though you may be right, I'd agree your view there is not conservative. It's more properly labeled as regressive.

Wouldn't conservatives be defending the original religions vs the tyranny of exotic Christian religion that was being forced down their hick throats because the King (central authority) deems it best for them?

Santourm, Glenn Beck, and you have been doing exactly that. Okay I might give you a bit of credit as you're not quite as strong arming as Islam but the calls from Catholic Bishops to set laws for the nation is just as tyrannical.

 

[Dammy]

Claiming Islam says this is like claiming Christianity specifically calls for executions for all sorts of trivial things.
In fact, as far as I'm aware, the Q'ran makes no such calls.
The Bible on the other hand.....
Not that you'd think that relevant.

Volume 9, Book 83, Number 17:

Allah's Apostle said, "The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Apostle, cannot be shed except in three cases: In Qisas for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (apostate) and leaves the Muslims."​

Like Fluffy, I think all religions are stark-raving-bonkers, including Islam. However, this appears to me as nothing more than a thinly veiled display of "Christian = good; Jew = good; but Muslin = bad"
Or to put it another way, bigotry.

I must be winning this debate if you have to stoop low enough to call my posting bigotry. I have issues with the Christian denominations, but they are not going out and about to ass rape and then execute an former member for leaving their religion. I'm all for defending Mosques from being forced to purchase insurance coverage that conflicts with their belief system, how about you?

 

[Dammy]

This seems like a strange comment from the fellow who desires Catholic laws to be instituted within the central government. Though you may be right, I'd agree your view there is not conservative. It's more properly labeled as regressive.

Santourm, Glenn Beck, and you have been doing exactly that. Okay I might give you a bit of credit as you're not quite as strong arming as Islam but the calls from Catholic Bishops to set laws for the nation is just as tyrannical.

You have a strange way of looking things. Guess I'm a Islamist as well since I support their right not to purchase insurance that conflicts with their religious views. Allowing people to peacefully practice their religion (whatever flavor it is) is a right, demanding they change their religious views because it's popular with the Progressives is not right, it's very wrong.

 

[Robert]

Volume 9, Book 83, Number 17:

Like I said, not in the Q'ran.

And even if it was, what would that prove? Plenty of calls for killing in the Bible....

Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests
Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)

Kill Witches
You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Kill Fortunetellers
A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

Death for Hitting Dad
Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)

Death for Cursing Parents
All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9 NLT)

Death for Adultery
If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)

Death for Fornication
A priest's daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 NAB)

Death to Followers of Other Religions
Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)

Kill Nonbelievers
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)

Kill False Prophets
If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord." When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through. (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)

Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night
But if this charge is true (that she wasn't a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father's house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB)

Kill Followers of Other Religions
Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshiping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. When you hear about it, investigate the matter thoroughly. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17:2-5 NLT)

Kill False Prophets
But any prophet who claims to give a message from another god or who falsely claims to speak for me must die.' You may wonder, 'How will we know whether the prophecy is from the LORD or not?' If the prophet predicts something in the LORD's name and it does not happen, the LORD did not give the message. That prophet has spoken on his own and need not be feared. (Deuteronomy 18:20-22 NLT)

Kill Anyone who Approaches the Tabernacle
For the LORD had said to Moses, 'Exempt the tribe of Levi from the census; do not include them when you count the rest of the Israelites. You must put the Levites in charge of the Tabernacle of the Covenant, along with its furnishings and equipment. They must carry the Tabernacle and its equipment as you travel, and they must care for it and camp around it. Whenever the Tabernacle is moved, the Levites will take it down and set it up again. Anyone else who goes too near the Tabernacle will be executed.' (Numbers 1:48-51 NLT)

Kill People for Working on the Sabbath
The LORD then gave these further instructions to Moses: 'Tell the people of Israel to keep my Sabbath day, for the Sabbath is a sign of the covenant between me and you forever. It helps you to remember that I am the LORD, who makes you holy. Yes, keep the Sabbath day, for it is holy. Anyone who desecrates it must die; anyone who works on that day will be cut off from the community. Work six days only, but the seventh day must be a day of total rest. I repeat: Because the LORD considers it a holy day, anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death.' (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT)

Peaceful religion at work, right enough.

 

[faethor]

You have a strange way of looking things. Guess I'm a Islamist as well since I support their right not to purchase insurance that conflicts with their religious views.

Though again the freedom isn't in the end-user of the insurance. What you've done is assert the will of the bosses aka Mullah and Priests, to force their opinions onto that of the employees. Since their opinion is backed by their religious views and you want this opinion to be the law you have successfully surplaned the freedom of individual choice with the religious mandate.

Allowing people to peacefully practice their religion (whatever flavor it is) is a right, demanding they change their religious views because it's popular with the Progressives is not right, it's very wrong.

Some how I don't think you'd be happy to see your daughter be the 5th wife of your neighbor because that's their religious views OR be comfortable your son was a blood sacrifice because that's their relifious views.

Perhaps I'm wrong? Do you support over turning the US ban on same-sex marriage? Some Gays have indicated that not having this right conflicts with their religious views.

 

[FluffyMcDeath]

Lot good that does that poor guy waiting on them to ass rape him before they execute him.

You're thinking of Abu Ghraib.

 

[FluffyMcDeath]

No, I would say it would be a conservative to allow individual liberty to reign over religion that the centralized government has endorsed.

It's funny because often the way you label yourself and what you believe in have nothing to do with each other. Mind you, the way you label other people and what they believe in have very little relationship either.

Conservatives have always been about protecting the old power structures which tend to be hierarchical and authoritarian - lords, kings, churches, the rich. That's exactly the same today if you look at what interests conservative policies are protecting. And while the Democratic party likes to message to progressives, the party powerful are almost all Conservative.