Logic

cecilia said:
well, it took them long enough

Instagram and Facebook Ban Far-Right Extremists
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"Far Right Extremist" Louis Farrakhan

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FluffyMcDeath said:
Everyone is a far right extremist - as soon as they put a foot wrong and say something the party disagrees with. This is not something to celebrate - unless you never have your own opinions.
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It's called polarization.

The US is in deep, deep trouble and we can only watch and try not being dragged along. :(
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Everyone is a far right extremist - as soon as they put a foot wrong and say something the party disagrees with. This is not something to celebrate - unless you never have your own opinions.
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feel free to argue about specific individuals, but one that I fully 100% agree should be denied access to social media is that jackass alex jones.
that piece of shit put forth the moronic conspiracy theory that the families in Sandy Hook lied about their children being killed.

Insane morons who believe his crap then go on to torture these families who are already grieving. It's bad enough that a parent has to suffer the WORST horror - losing their young child, but now they have to deal with insensitive vile scum, stalking and taunting them. One of these bastards is in jail for this behavior. At least one family has had to move about 7 times to escape from these idiots. One man finally just killed himself.

And jones is responsible for all of this.

He doesn't deserve the right to flood the internet with his vile vomitous garbage. He should rot in jail, frankly

How's THAT for a strong {bleep} opinion?
 
cecilia said:
feel free to argue about specific individuals, but one that I fully 100% agree should be denied access to social media is that jackass alex jones.
that piece of shit put forth the moronic conspiracy theory that the families in Sandy Hook lied about their children being killed.
[...]
How's THAT for a strong {bleep} opinion?
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Pretty strong, but I disagree. Stalking is a crime and the stalkers are criminally responsible for their crimes. Incitement is a crime but did Jones tell people to go and harass other people? He did not. But the views of Alex Jones on some issues was fringey in the extreme, on others much less so, however, by cutting off the fringes you don't get rid of the fringes any more than you can make a rope with one end by cutting off the other end. Every time you banish the extremes, whoever was next to the extremes become the new extremes. Over the years it has been interesting to watch this very dynamic play out in the SJW communities as they iteratively refine their ideology and more and more nominally reasonable positions are classified as extreme (or evil).

The purge started with Alex Jones precisely because he was widely disliked so it would likely see little push-back and slippery slopers objected (I among them) and so followed a whole raft of bans - and Alex Jones is still being used as a way to justify the bans. If all of your opinions are the officially sanctioned opinions then these bans will never effect you (except in the sense that a paucity of opinions will lead to a loss of the diversity which a society needs to meet future challenges).
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
officially sanctioned opinions
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This isn't about opinions I like.

I don't care if some morons believe the earth is flat, or other idiotic ideas. I can live - and have lived - with all sorts of stupid notions. After all, I survived 16 years of Catholic School. I never got into fights with anyone.

Jones and his evil ideas have killed people. And caused immeasurable harm. THAT's why he should be shunned by everyone on the planet.

if your ideas are laughed at, I don't care what you say. Keep babbling like a moron.

But if your ideas kill, that's a different story.
It's like moronic anti-vaxxers. THOSE people are responsible for the death of children. I think wakefield should be in jail. He can share a cell with Jones.

this isn't about the law. It's about ethics
 
cecilia said:
Jones and his evil ideas have killed people. And caused immeasurable harm. THAT's why he should be shunned by everyone on the planet.
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As I said, I simply disagree. Jones hasn't killed anyone. His show may have lead to people acting badly but if that is the grounds for shutting people up there would not be a mosque standing (and that is something that would appeal to my emotions, but I could not support it).
But if your ideas kill, that's a different story.
It's like moronic anti-vaxxers. THOSE people are responsible for the death of children. I think wakefield should be in jail. He can share a cell with Jones.
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To say that people should go to jail for thinking the wrong things, you argue for the jailing of the deluded. If you judge that someone doesn't believe what they are saying then you are mind reading, you are sending people to jail for what you think they think or what you think they mean - and that may be a power that you would like to have but it is a power that no-one should have.

People should have the freedom to speak as they wish (outside of directly instructing others to cause harm). The "solutions" to silence people you deem need silencing are worse than the bad speech (in my opinion).
 
cecilia said:
This isn't about opinions I like.
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Imagine that there was a country being ruled by someone who was actively at war with the press and wanted to shut down opinions that disagreed with his own. Imagine that said leader could encourage an atmosphere in which annoying or uncomfortable voices could be shut down and the people would celebrate it. Imagine that when others were shut down the people would make excuses for it. When other, less abrasive voices were also shut down, the people wouldn't even hear about it usually, and if they did they could rationalise that it must have been because those were bad people. Imagine the people getting used to having people shut down and either feeling nothing or actually celebrating it. What moral ground do you stand on, and what allies do you have left, when that power is used against you and those you agree with? It is happening, and fast. We don't actually know which way this will turn next. This isn't a grass roots thing, it's all coming from extremely wealthy, politically (and intelligence) connected companies. In all likelihood, their interests are not the same as yours.
The internet, which gave the people great power and scared living hell out of the elites, has been beaten back and caged and controlled and now they are pruning off all the bits that threaten their power.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Imagine that there was a country being ruled by someone who was actively at war with the press
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Jones is not a journalist. and it's not that I disagree with his "words". It's that he incited crazy people to illegal behavior which ended up torturing people who lost their children.

if you don't like jail, then I suggest he be sued to the bottom of his wallet.
 
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cecilia said:
Jones is not a journalist.
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That's debatable. Jones has done and said some questionable things, but Info Wars also were the ones to break some major stories over the years. Jones is most certainly not alone doing questionable things. The major Liberal Media outlets have been doing it forever, like CNN doxxing and harassing an elderly woman.

Jones was the canary in the coal mine. He was the test run for deplatforming a person. They were able to get away with it, so the blueprint was set. They've subsequently been deplatforming one effective conservative after another. Milo Yiannopoulos, Gavin McInnes and many others have been deplatformed through no violation of TOS, only for wrong thought. Many liberals cheer it on and don't care of the consequences. What they fail to see is that it will not stop with conservatives. The end goal is total control, the same thing will happen to liberals with wrong thought. It is already starting. Enter Tim Pool. He is a genuine journalist who happens to be a Democrat. He got his name known when he started off covering Occupy Wall Street. The beginning of deplatforming Tim Pool has begun.

 
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redrumloa said:
That's debatable. Jones has done and said some questionable things, but Info Wars also were the ones to break some major stories over the years. Jones is most certainly not alone doing questionable things. The major Liberal Media outlets have been doing it forever, like CNN doxxing and harassing an elderly woman.

Jones was the canary in the coal mine. He was the test run for deplatforming a person. They were able to get away with it, so the blueprint was set. They've subsequently been deplatforming one effective conservative after another.
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Not just conservatives. They've been deplatforming everyone - at least everyone who isn't an employee of a major media company.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Not just conservatives. They've been deplatforming everyone - at least everyone who isn't an employee of a major media company.
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Somewhat true, which is why I used Tim Pool as an example. They are starting to go after journalists on the left.
 
redrumloa said:
Somewhat true, which is why I used Tim Pool as an example. They are starting to go after journalists on the left.
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There was a spate of leftists who got the treatment right after delighting in the fate of Alex Jones. It was a while back now and I don't remember the details, but I remember the hubbub.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
There was a spate of leftists who got the treatment right after delighting in the fate of Alex Jones.
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And it continues, usually with no TOS broken and no explanation given. Some of them total head scratchers. BPS (Black Pigeon Speaks) is especially baffling. He's a vegan who is known for rescuing pigeons!

(Short 3 minute video)
 
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