Palin vs Biden the last VP debate

[faethor]

What'd everyone think...

Palin came off better then I expected. My problem with her answers is that they were sound bites. She did do her answer whatever question you want some brief times. And of course Reaganisms thrown in. Reagan is some sort of perfect Republican, but with Palin's age and the era we're in now it made her feel old and out of touch.

Biden too came off better then I expected. He seemed to be direct and decisive. His answers had more depth then Palin's. I don't think he came off as charismatic as she is.

The end question for people should be which of these 2 people can step into the role of President in a crisis. Looking at just this 1 debate the answer is Biden.

**Note.. I didn't watch the debate. I did listen to it on the radio.

 

[Wayne]

Like you, I think that Palin did better than expected, but I still feel that most of what she read was entirely scripted and she was on auto pilot, choosing rehearsed bullet points to counter what Biden said. You can do that after a week in debate boot camp I guess.

What shares the living shit out of me is the idea of another Jesus freak moron in the White House who can't even pronounce the word nuclear correctly.

The first time I heard her say "noo kya larr".. I cringed hard and thought.. "So THAT's how McSame chose her..."

Wayne

 

[smithy]

What'd everyone think...

Palin came off better then I expected. My problem with her answers is that they were sound bites. She did do her answer whatever question you want some brief times. And of course Reaganisms thrown in. Reagan is some sort of perfect Republican, but with Palin's age and the era we're in now it made her feel old and out of touch.

Biden too came off better then I expected. He seemed to be direct and decisive. His answers had more depth then Palin's. I don't think he came off as charismatic as she is.

The end question for people should be which of these 2 people can step into the role of President in a crisis. Looking at just this 1 debate the answer is Biden.

**Note.. I didn't watch the debate. I did listen to it on the radio.

I watched it on YouTube. The first half anyway, I got bored after that. Having never seen one of these debates before, I'd expected a Punch 'n Judy type show, a bit like what you'd find at Prime Minister Question Time, but in fact it was very civilised, more like reeling off a load of facts.

I thought the whole thing was a bit boring and I learned nothing. I think the format is wrong - they should be asking each other questions. That way we'd get some probing questions, cross-questionig and maybe a bit of insight into the pair of them. I don't know who the winner was, but the loser is the voter!

 

[Wayne]

Like you, I think that Palin did better than expected, but I still feel that most of what she read was entirely scripted and she was on auto pilot, choosing rehearsed bullet points to counter what Biden said. You can do that after a week in debate boot camp I guess.

I have to add that it was fun to watch and instantly recognizable when she went off-script because she'd hem and haw around the question, then toss in a blessing and try to equate herself to the average voter.

Biden came across as a politician, true, but he sounded confident and prepared to me.

The fact that I loathe Palin's accent aside (I just realized that she sounds like the principal's assistant in Ferris Bueller's Day Off don'cha know), she came across -- and I'm predisposed against McSame and Bible Spice -- as disingenuous to me.

A dear friend of mine passed this to me this morning and I think it's hilarious. Maybe we should put the two of them on a reality show and call it "McSame and Bible Spice : The TaliBaptists"...

Wayne

 

[ltstanfo]

What'd everyone think...

Palin came off better then I expected. My problem with her answers is that they were sound bites. She did do her answer whatever question you want some brief times. And of course Reaganisms thrown in. Reagan is some sort of perfect Republican, but with Palin's age and the era we're in now it made her feel old and out of touch.

Biden too came off better then I expected. He seemed to be direct and decisive. His answers had more depth then Palin's. I don't think he came off as charismatic as she is.

The end question for people should be which of these 2 people can step into the role of President in a crisis. Looking at just this 1 debate the answer is Biden.

**Note.. I didn't watch the debate. I did listen to it on the radio.

I watched the entire debate last night and I think it was a net draw. I don't think anyone's minds were changed or made up from this debate alone. I do think it was far more "watchable" than the horrible debate in Mississippi. To her credit, Ifill was an excellent moderator... far better then her colleague from PBS. Palen certainly held up better than most of the mainstream pundits were prognosticating and I have to admit that Biden for once in his life didn't commit his famous "gaffs" in public so he gave a good show as well.

As for who better can step into the role of president? Here again I see it as a draw. Last night showed me that Palin is a fast learner and in my opinion is capable of learing what she needs to know (as most VPs do when they enter office). Biden, while more experienced with the beltway insiders has no more direct experience to be president then Palen (IMO) so... draw.

As for the appeal factor (which unfortunately too many Americans seem to use as their only basis for voting... popularity), I would give a slight edge to Palin. As a reference, I offer this article.

Now let's see what happens in Nashville next week.

Regards,
Ltstanfo

 

[ltstanfo]

Biden came across as a politician, true, but he sounded confident and prepared to me.

Wayne

And that, IMO, is why Biden did not score a decisive win... he did come across as a true politician... and an insider at that. Having been there for 30 years makes it easy to paint you as an insider who is part of the problem

Regards,
Ltstanfo

 

[ltstanfo]

"McSame and Bible Spice : The TaliBaptists"...

Wayne

Small problem there... Palin isn't Baptist. :wink: :roll:

Regards,
Ltstanfo

 

[Wayne]

"McSame and Bible Spice : The TaliBaptists"...

Wayne

Small problem there... Palin isn't Baptist. :wink: :roll:

Regards,
Ltstanfo

She's not a spice girl either, but the name still sticks..

 

[Glaucus]

My favorite part was when Palin talked about the teachers in her family. Obviously none of them teach English. Her grammar and vocabulary (or lack thereof) makes George Bush look like a world renowned English professor. :roll: I never thought I'd see a greater anti-intellectual then George Bush, but Palin has so far proven me wrong.

 

[Glaucus]

I watched it on YouTube. The first half anyway, I got bored after that. Having never seen one of these debates before, I'd expected a Punch 'n Judy type show, a bit like what you'd find at Prime Minister Question Time, but in fact it was very civilised, more like reeling off a load of facts.

I watched for about 20 mins, then got bored and switched back to the Canadian prime minister's debate. And that was alot more interesting I thought. I was quite pleased with the beating the other four candidates gave Harper. The best way I could describe Jack Layton from the NDP is as a wrecking ball; he pretty much unloaded into Harper at every opportunity. This was good in two respects, it 1) gave Harper a nice black eye in front of everyone and 2) allowed Stephan Dion of the Liberals to look like the civilized one of the two main opposition parties. The other two candidates also focused most of their attention on Harper, who basically just sat there counting the seconds for the debate to end. Now that's entertainment! :-D

- Mike

 

[ltstanfo]

"McSame and Bible Spice : The TaliBaptists"...

Wayne

Small problem there... Palin isn't Baptist. :wink: :roll:

Regards,
Ltstanfo

She's not a spice girl either, but the name still sticks..

To each their own... you get to see a "spice girl" and I get to watch "the messiah / the annointed one". Either way it seems religion is involved. :wink:

Regards,
Ltstanfo

 

[ltstanfo]

My favorite part was when Palin talked about the teachers in her family. Obviously none of them teach English. Her grammar and vocabulary (or lack thereof) makes George Bush look like a world renowned English professor. :roll: I never thought I'd see a greater anti-intellectual then George Bush, but Palin has so far proven me wrong.

Interestingly that part of her debate is being lauded by some today as one of the reasons why she apparently "connected" so well last night... she is "mainstream" America. She comes across as an average person (unlike Joe... "I go to Lowes" Biden).

I'm neither defending nor attacking Palin for her speech / accent but in my experience the more you leave the large city / urban areas the more people sound like her (and not Joe).

Regards,
Ltstanfo

 

[Wayne]

To each their own... you get to see a "spice girl" and I get to watch "the messiah / the annointed one". Either way it seems religion is involved. :wink:

Regards,
Ltstanfo

I may have to revise her nickname out of reverence for intelligence of the average Spice Girl..



(In fairness, I do dig on the whole "Obamessiah" thing. As nicks go, it's fairly inventive).

Granting that each of the four candidates has continually placed their foot solidly in their mouths in the last 6 months, you can't seriously look me in the eye and say that Palin shows more intelligence than Bush can you? At least be honest here.

I just wish I knew who her voice reminded me of. The principal's secretary is close, but not quite..

(edit : AHA!!!! I've GOT IT! Sarah Palin talking sounds EXACTLY like when Lea Thompson was playing the grandma role in Back to the Future III!!!! Whew, now I feel better)

 

[Glaucus]

Interestingly that part of her debate is being lauded by some today as one of the reasons why she apparently "connected" so well last night... she is "mainstream" America. She comes across as an average person (unlike Joe... "I go to Lowes" Biden).

Let me ask you something, when hiring someone for the job, do you look for "average joe" applicants, or the person best suited for the job? If you were about to get your heart operated on, would you want a good looking, witty surgeon from a small town, or just the best damn surgeon money can buy? Is Palin's good looks (not that I find her good looking, but it seems many do) and small town accent gonna solve the problems on Wall street, or restrain Putin or put an end to the Palestinian/Isreali issue or convince Iran to forget about it's nuclear ambitions? I would think not, which is unfortunate because really that's all she's got going for her. Her telling me that she's got a teacher in the familly doesn't tell me much. My sister's a medical doctor who's starting to train/test med students, does that make me even more qualified? Give me a break!

- Mike

 

[Speelgoedmannetje]

Granting that each of the four candidates has continually placed their foot solidly in their mouths in the last 6 months, you can't seriously look me in the eye and say that Palin shows more intelligence than Bush can you? At least be honest here.

They're all baboons to me... The fact that one has a bigger red arse doesn't make them any less baboon....

 

[Glaucus]

I just wish I knew who her voice reminded me of. The principal's secretary is close, but not quite..

She reminds me of the sheriff in Fargo.

 

[ltstanfo]

Let me ask you something, when hiring someone for the job, do you look for "average joe" applicants, or the person best suited for the job? If you were about to get your heart operated on, would you want a good looking, witty surgeon from a small town, or just the best damn surgeon money can buy? Is Palin's good looks (not that I find her good looking, but it seems many do) and small town accent gonna solve the problems on Wall street, or restrain Putin or put an end to the Palestinian/Isreali issue or convince Iran to forget about it's nuclear ambitions? I would think not, which is unfortunate because really that's all she's got going for her. Her telling me that she's got a teacher in the familly doesn't tell me much. My sister's a medical doctor who's starting to train/test med students, does that make me even more qualified? Give me a break!

- Mike

Good question. While I know what you are intending to ask, the phrasing didn't help you. How good is the small town surgeon (witty and good looking or not)? Getting the best in the field does not have to mean they are currently working at the Mayo Clinic. I'd be more inclined to ask what experience they have as a heart surgeon? What is their success / failure rate?

As for her not having anything going for her, she does meet several common considerations for president (let alone VP):

1. Mayor (small town or not) - many politicians get their start here.
2. Governor - considered by many to be a baseline for presidential office. Recent presidents have included both Clinton and Bush. Also lets not forget Carter and Regan. Now obvioiusly opinions vary on how good those previous occupants were but they all share that in common.

I don't see that Biden is anymore qualified to be VP than Palin is... seriously. I still hold that most if not all VPs get their learning on the job, since they are second to the president and are obviously expected to tow the presidential line. Palin appears to be a quick study.

Is she better than Biden? I don't know. Biden has never been a governor.

Regards,
Ltstanfo

 

[Wayne]

I just wish I knew who her voice reminded me of. The principal's secretary is close, but not quite..

She reminds me of the sheriff in Fargo.

I'd only seen bits of that movie, but you're absolutely right.

Wayne

 

[ltstanfo]

I just wish I knew who her voice reminded me of. The principal's secretary is close, but not quite..

She reminds me of the sheriff in Fargo.

I'd only seen bits of that movie, but you're absolutely right.

Wayne

Who actually turned out to be a pretty good person.

Regards,
Ltstanfo

 

[Wayne]

Who actually turned out to be a pretty good person.

I don't think anyone here is debating whether or not she's a good person. I don't think anyone here truly knows her past the speeches she has been forced to regurgitate. My opinion is that even she doesn't swallow half of what she's saying.

I'm simply making the point that -- much like the sheriff from Fargo in the movie -- she both creeps me out and annoys me.

What you see is "at least it's not Obama". What I see is "gun toting, Jesus freak redneck wannabe who would probably consistently lose to Bush in a game of go fish." Try as the Republican party might, they need to just give up and understand that no amount of lipstick is going to EVER turn Palin into "Mary Ann" (from Gilligan's Island).

There's nothing wrong with either view. I'm just sitting here thinking about the whole process and find myself amazed at the paradigm shift in my own thought processes.

When Obama was first announced, I was very much anti-Obama on the grounds that you had stated (who is he / lack of experience, etc). Then slowly, when Grampa Munster was announced, I was thinking "this is a crap choice, I guess I'm voting none of the above again this year".

A short while later, after hearing McSame spout Bush policies (and we'll be in Iraq 100 years if that's what it takes), I found myself thinking of Obama as "the lesser of two evils". Followed by actually listening to both candidates and what they espouse. Thus begat finding myself sitting in Obama's corner saying "well, he may not be experienced, but at least he's not another George Bush".

Hence cometh the two debates, and I've gone even further beyond my initial thoughts to honestly believing that Obama is not only the lesser of the two evils, but the better man for the job..

Why or how this change came about, I guess I'll never know. Whether I'm right or wrong, I guess only time will tell, but I'm just of the frame of mind that Bush pretty much destroyed America in the 8 years he had, and right or wrong, I just can't stand the idea of four more of the same failed policies and politics, which is all that McCain represents to me.

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

Wayne