PC Cooling issue... Need input...

Wayne

Wayne

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I might have put this in the Hackintosh thread, but it's not really related to the Hackintosh part as much as the part about the PC hardware...

Anyone here know anything about PC cooling? My machine ordinarily runs about 100F at idle (normal). It even runs fine converting other files or stressing it in other ways (gaming, converting MKV files, etc) just fine at around 140F -- what I would consider heavily loaded), but as soon as I start compressing AVI to MP4 files, it shoots up to 208 to 212F....

AVI files and MKV video files are all being compressed/converted by the same exact program (iFlicks 2).

The current CPU cooler (a Cooler Master Hyper T2) appears to be properly seated. Not sure what else I can do other than to investigate liquid cooling, or placing the whole thing in a bigger case with a much bigger cooler.

Both options run about the same cost-wise but if I have to rip it down to rebuild into a new case, I'm going to be sorely tempted to buy a full size ATX motherboard that has Thunderbolt so that I can load a firewire 800 card and other fun goodies. All of this turns a nothing into another $500 experiment.

Any ideas?
 
how many fans do you have on the cooler?

I see the hyper T2 comes with no fans
it has optional 92mm fan mounts

I use an 212 on my 8 core, with dual 120 mm fans, 1 push, 1 pull
it is too big for case though, been meaning to make a custom case ...
for a 212 to fit in the case, the case needs to be 9" + wide
 
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The T2 cooler has a, I think, 80mm fan on it. The case has one 2x 120mm fans, one pulling in the front, one pushing out the back, with room for two more (one on the front, one on the top)... I don't know however that the fans would make that much of a difference opposed to a different (better/bigger) cooler. I have a 212, but it won't fit into the Cooler Master Silencio 352 case I'm currently using, or the Fractal Design Node 304 case I moved away from (truly too small for effective airflow)...

Here's the build so far.

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/segwayne/saved/wrYG3C

Wayne
 
to lower cpu temperature your choices are:

increase the air flow though radiator / cooler
lower the case temperature ( heat sink temperature )
increase surface area of radiator / cooler
lower cpu voltage ( run slower )
 
more heat pipes per the D92 would help
T2 = 2 heat pipes
D92 = 4 heat pipes and 200% more radiator volume than the T2
the D92 comes with 92mm dual offset fans standard (offset eleminates the dead space in center of fan )

the first fan on the cooler helps the most, the 2nd probably only increases air flow 25 to 50% , cant find a flow chart with specific airflow ratings

https://pcpartpicker.com/part/cooler-master-cpu-cooler-rrhd9228pkr1
 
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Do you have enough space to use a bigger cooler? The Hyper T2 is being marketed as a "compact cooler" which might be the problem.

I am a proponent of silent computing. I use a fanless PSU, a fanless Radeon 5870 and an i7 with a very large cooler and a single active fan that runs at a fairly low constant speed (700 RPM). I have never had any heat issues... (I do use a full-size Fractal Design tower, however, so airflow should be better than with a smaller case.)
 
metalman said:
more heat pipes per the D92 would help
T2 = 2 heat pipes
D92 = 4 heat pipes and 200% more radiator volume than the T2
the D92 comes with 92mm dual offset fans standard (offset eleminates the dead space in center of fan )
Click to expand...
That explains it probably. My Scythe Mugen cooler has 6 heat pipes even. It is quite heavy but much more compact than my old Thermaltake Sonic Tower cooler, which also features 6 heat pipes.
 
JoBBo said:
Do you have enough space to use a bigger cooler?
Click to expand...
Therein apparently lies the biggest part of the problem... Space. As it is now, the exit fan is about an inch away from the heat sink, so I'm fairly certain I couldn't fit another fan in that location.

The only thing I can think that might be wrong is -- as you surmised -- the T2 is built for compact cases but probably not for a 4ghz i7 processor (no, it's not overclocked)... It's what I ended up with from the local MicroCenter after the Cooler Master Hyper 212 I bought (and still have) wouldn't fit.

There's also the probability that I spread the thermal paste on too thick There were no instructions and I had never used paste before, so I watched a video or two but ended up using the entire tiny tube of goo that it came with to cover the processor.

All that being said, and after a lot of thought today, I picked up one of the Corsair H80i GT liquid coolers and plan to install it tomorrow (time, and patience permitting of course).

Like the D92 (which I'd never heard of until now), it has two fans for the radiator, one push, one pull, both 120mm PWM fans... The cost to go liquid cooling, thanks to an Amazon sale with free same-day shipping, was about as much as pretty much anything else I had considered and I'm curious about Liquid Cooling.. (Thank you Amazon Prime!)

Like I said, the T2 runs it fine 90% of the time, even playing COD4 at 60fps on 2560x1440 ultra details. It's just that one app with that one file apparently... I also picked up an additional Cooler Master AF120 to fill the vacant fan slot above the CPU.

If another fan and going liquid doesn't fix it, I don't know what will.

Wayne
 
I doubt the thermal paste is too thick, once the heat sink is clamped in place any extra is just squeezed out
it takes a very small amount of thermal paste, just cover the cpu and the heat sink with a thin uniform film, then assemble

water cooling is much more efficient than air cooling, since water is denser than air
for water: 1btu = raising the temperature of 1lb of water 1 degree
you can always lower your heat sink temperature by adding a peltier cooler to chill the water reservoir
and a radiator and fan to also cool the case
takes additional 12v power to supply the peltier's though
 
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metalman said:
you can always lower your heat sink temperature by adding a peltier cooler to chill the water reservoir
Click to expand...
The Corsair H80i GT is a sealed system using some variation of anti-freeze as I understand it, so there is no water reservoir and nothing to fill. It also comes with the paste pre-applied, so that's one less thing for me to screw up.

This morning when I got up at 5:15am, the machine had shut down. No indication in the logs as of why except that the last entry was at 3:38am (something about verifying an iCloud account password). When I cycled the power, I got nothing. No response at all. I truly thought the entire thing was dead for a moment except for the fact I could see and hear the system fans running.

I shined a flashlight in the case and noticed the CPU fan was not spinning. I reached in and flicked it, it started, and the system came up as though nothing had happened.

Weird...
 
your cpu fan is bearing is sticking, it needs replaced or lubricated
don't run the computer with a bad cpu fan, your cpu can die from overheat

the fan can be lubricated with some silicon lubricant on the bearing to keep the fan going, as long as the bearing is just dry
you need to peal the sticker over the bearing and lubricate


In the case of the Corsair H80I GT the reservoir is just the amount of fluid in the radiator & hoses

there are separate reservoirs available that can be used in water cooling setups
 
metalman said:
your cpu fan is bearing is sticking, it needs replaced or lubricated
Click to expand...
Would be odd, but not unheard of, as it's essentially a brand new fan/cooler.

I'll start replacing it around 4pm (another 5 hours), so hopefully the world won't come to an end between now and then...

Wayne
 
Keep in mind that a water pump does use quite a bit more juice than a fan, so make sure you have the overhead available from the PSU to supply it if it doesn't run on its own.

I used to run an overclocked AthlonXP at 2Ghz (stock was 1700Mhz) with watercooling. What did for it in the end was the PSU eating itself.

Absolutely loved that rig, especially the fact it caused the house lights to dim when I fired it up.
 
Got the Corsair H80i GT installed. Motherboard may not survive another build because of my fat fingered approach (snapped a connector housing on the motherboard, maybe munged the pins a bit..)

Anyway, it's up and running with one additional 120mm fan. Didn't have PWM connectors in the case, so the fans are currently plugged directly to the PS via cable (100% on). Not sure whether it's;
  1. the water cooling,
  2. the non-botched installation of the cooler, or
  3. the fact it now has a turbo 120mm fan pointed straight down at it
but the system has gone from around 100 fahrenheit at idle to between 80-83 fahrenheit, which is all that much better.

I haven't stress tested it yet, waiting on other issues to resolve and for the core to "seat" with the paste applied, but as soon as a get a PWM splitter, hopefully the case will go from "old style AT case loud" back to "just hear it when it's stressed"...

Thanks for all the pointers..

Wayne
 
Argo said:
oom for cooling and graphics card is the reason
Click to expand...
Yeah, I know. I regret not going with a similar "huge" case, but coming from a real mac where I'm used to "tiny" was something I wanted to try to get to. I didn't remember how annoying working on PC hardware was, let alone consider the idea of trying to do so in tiny cramped spaces..

Originally, I started out with a Fractal Design Node 304 case, which is actually about 1/2 the size of the case it's now in.. That didn't last long...
 
Yup. Small PC cases are a real pain in the arse. Manufacturers like HP and Apple can get away with them because they can make custom ducts and board layouts, and they do tons of thermal analysis. But for us folks without that time and money, if you want any type of performance you almost have to go with a big case. The easiest first step to having good airflow is having enough room for the air to actually flow. Large, low RPM fans are much better at moving air, and much less audible than the annoying small ones.

And, I'd agree, if you used the whole tube of heat sink paste, that is probably too much. :D And paste often isn't as effective as a non-paste compound, to begin with. On my old overclocked AMD rig, I learned that Arctic Silver compound (or likely any other good brand) really is quite a bit better than the generic stuff.

Personally, I've always just air cooled, but outside of that my old AMD rig, I usually don't go too crazy on overclocking. (I think I had a 50% overclock and .5v overvolt on my old AMD before it finally exploded the southbridge on the motherboard and I unceremoniously pitched it.)
 
Wayne said:
Yeah, I know. I regret not going with a similar "huge" case, but coming from a real mac where I'm used to "tiny" was something I wanted to try to get to. I didn't remember how annoying working on PC hardware was, let alone consider the idea of trying to do so in tiny cramped spaces..

Originally, I started out with a Fractal Design Node 304 case, which is actually about 1/2 the size of the case it's now in.. That didn't last long...
Click to expand...

I main drive in my choice of case was not getting my hands cut up. I've worked on too many other's computer with small cheap punched metal cases with lots of sharp edges.
 
With air cooling, a small case and a beefy GPU that isn't venting to the outside, those temps would be considered perfectly normal, the only way to get your CPU temp down is with, as you have done, a liquid cooler.
 
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