The Fluffy Budget

[FluffyMcDeath]

Let's take a look at where the money comes from and where it's going.

OK, looking at what "the people" pay in as income tax and Social Security deductions, it's it easily pays for Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid which are programs that directly go back to the people. That's right, Social Security isn't an "entitlement", it's something you pay for then get back (unless you consider stuff like your savings an entitlement). In fact, it covers a good chunk of the "other" mandatory spending also - so the stuff that benefits the people is already paid for by the people.
The stuff that benefits business (wars for oil and strategic control of oil, wars for control of governments and land etc - and the giant war machine that makes the bombs to replace the bombs that are dropped) seem to be falling behind. They should be paying more for the things that benefit them. Some industries should also be paying for things like ... hmmm ... how about cleaning up their oil spills. Close a few loopholes on companies like GE, and tax them for sending jobs overseas too and there'll be a few billion more in the pot.
Add in a Tobin tax to put a 0.0005% tax on financial transactions to slow down the speculative traders that blew up the economy and there'll be a few more billions in the pot.
Let the Bush tax cuts lapse because they obviously don't create jobs and throw those billions in the pot.
Now quit a few wars and stop throwing money at no-bid contractors and we should be able to cut a couple of hundred billion out of the military.
Consider also that many drug patents are about to expire and this could lead to massive savings in Medicare/caid.
And finally, the US should get back in touch with its Constitutional power to issue the money of the United States instead of borrowing it from banks. Doing that would save it the annual quarter billion in interest payments.
Dickering about with that I can get within a couple hundred billion of balanced. Cut the military a bit more ruthlessly to just a half a trillion a year and I can get there.
It would be interesting to know what's in the "other" discretionary and the "other" mandatory but I can leave that till later.

So, I got a balanced budget and you don't have to quite your job to look after your parents full time.

 

[cecilia]

if only I (or we) were in charge of the budget.
Being extremely frugal it's easy for me to do

I'm with you...cut that crappy military waste

 

[cecilia]

and that discretionary stuff is probably congress salaries which should be eliminated as most of those asshats are not doing their job

 

[faethor]

What I find interesting is the right-wing likes to talk return. For example: Schools and especially early childhood education have shown to be on of the best returns on spending we can make as a nation. What I see many Republicans demanding is a stop or cut to school spending and an increase into prison and law enforcement. Somehow they miss the glaringly obvious that these two things go hand in hand. You can spend to education a kid who becomes a productive citizen and in they return the money by paying more taxes. Or you can not do that and let the child fallow producing a tax burden which only worsens when they are bored, do something illegal, and get sent to prision. ... Is it much wonder why our education prowess is falling down against the developed world or why the 'land of the free' has the highest incarceration rate in the world. Perhaps the Republicans should understand return instead of giving it lipservice.

 

[FluffyMcDeath]

Or you can not do that and let the child fallow producing a tax burden which only worsens when they are bored, do something illegal, and get sent to prision.

There is a return on slave labour - and they don't usually get a say in the composition of the government either. Lock 'em up, work 'em, hard and they can't even vote you out. That's how thinks were done before oil and it looks like that's how things will be done after oil too.

 

[cecilia]

fascists love slavery, yes they do....and the dumber the better

150 years ago it was against the law to teach a slave to read because Knowledge is Power.
now they just print lies in the textbooks and try to substitute that creationism crap for science

 

[Dammy]

First, Social Security is a ponzi scheme and is running out of money as is Medicare: http://content.usatoday.com/communi...-social-security-obama-geithner-republicans/1

So how about telling us how Canada gains income? I would be interested to see what the Corp tax rates are and what the top rates are for income earners in Canada, including SIN and Canada Health payments.

One thing you have to look at with the US budget, we have something that the Democrats forced on Nixon called Baseline Budgeting. That sets a 7.5% automatic increase in the budget. The other thing is that the current baseline budget has the Stimulious now added into it each year. That's right, it wasn't a one shot deal like most of us thought in 2009, it's there growing at 7.5% each year. Yes, we are crazy down here. Be prepared to beef up your boarder crossings for Americans illegally entering into Canada looking for work and food, and there is a lot of us.

 

[FluffyMcDeath]

So how about telling us how Canada gains income? I would be interested to see what the Corp tax rates are and what the top rates are for income earners in Canada, including SIN and Canada Health payments.

Under our current government we are a vassal of the US. There is a strong move afoot to "integrate" & "harmonize" which means to take on all the worst policies from the US and let business run roughshod all over us. It really got going under Brian Mulroney who crammed through "Free Trade" despite huge public opposition. The Conservatives were wiped out in elections following that but we were never able to abrogate the agreement. It doesn't matter what party you vote in.

Now, obviously you didn't click on this link when I posted it in the Mass Layoff thread but go look at it now. Canadas's corporate tax rate is higher than the US. Unfortunately what this means (along with relaxed ownership rules due to free trade) is that American companies buy Canadian companies, run them as branches that move the money back to the US company to pay the taxes there instead of in Canada where the money is actually made. This gradually forces us to reduce our corporate tax rate too but it doesn't gain us any jobs. We're just giving away the store to stay in the same place meanwhile government income falls and our lads in parliament continue to subsidize the private banks by borrowing from them despite the fact that Canada has a bank of its own that it can borrow from.

Free trade is now very difficult to escape from - it was a crappy deal for Canada. It is now largely subsumed by even more ridiculous international agreements on trade that are even more intractable. I'm not happy about it and I do what I can locally but the rot starts south of us. Once you collapse and your suckers start to shrivel up I think we can start putting our house in order.

 

[Dammy]

That link is full of it. US Corp tax top rate is 38%! Less you are a friend of Obama, like GE's $5B in profits, then you pay nothing. Although not all of us who own evil corps are doing as well as multi national billion dollar companies who can go off shore and pay millions of dollars to lawyers to limit Federal Corp taxes. Last I heard, top Canada Crop tax rate is somewhere near 16%. Which do you think is more business friendly (minus the multi national corps), 16% or 38%?

Dammy

 

[faethor]

First, Social Security is a ponzi scheme and is running out of money as is Medicare:

Social Security is self funded and will be solvent for a fairly long time. A bad economy keeping the elderly working is even helping as social security isn't needing to pay out as much as it could.

So what we see is starting with Reagan the borrowing of Social Security excess. The reason it's running out is this has been going on for 30 years. It needs to stop. And since it was borrowing that loan needs to be paid back. This keeps Social Security solvent for many, many years to come. Probably through the end of your lifetime.

One thing you have to look at with the US budget, we have something that the Democrats forced on Nixon called Baseline Budgeting.

Oh yes Nixon was so weak he couldn't make his own decisions and Dems held him at gunpoint. Whatever. The old Dem statement of "The buck stops here" is not one you want to apply to Republicans. You need to get out of this mindset that somehow failures are due to Dems forcing Republicans to do something. Instead force the Republicans to take responsibility for their actions. Afterall they signed their name on the dotted line here. It's the only way you'll return economic conservatism to the Republican Party. They lost that about 50 years ago.

 

[Dammy]

Social Security is self funded and will be solvent for a fairly long time. A bad economy keeping the elderly working is even helping as social security isn't needing to pay out as much as it could.

Oh really?

http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/social-security-cash-flow-suddenly-negative

http://www.ssa.gov/oact/trsum/index.html

Now what am I supposed to be getting? SS is bust and I'm probably still alive receiving my checks. If things do not change, it'll be bust about the time I am can go on SS.

So what we see is starting with Reagan the borrowing of Social Security excess. The reason it's running out is this has been going on for 30 years. It needs to stop. And since it was borrowing that loan needs to be paid back. This keeps Social Security solvent for many, many years to come. Probably through the end of your lifetime.

Except it wasn't Reagan who did that. What a shocker huh? Who did this dastardly deed against the old people? Why it was LBJ:

"On-Budget"-
In early 1968 President Lyndon Johnson made a change in the budget presentation by including Social Security and all other trust funds in a"unified budget." This is likewise sometimes described by saying that Social Security was placed "on-budget."

http://www.ssa.gov/history/BudgetTreatment.html

Oh yes Nixon was so weak he couldn't make his own decisions and Dems held him at gunpoint. Whatever. The old Dem statement of "The buck stops here" is not one you want to apply to Republicans. You need to get out of this mindset that somehow failures are due to Dems forcing Republicans to do something. Instead force the Republicans to take responsibility for their actions. Afterall they signed their name on the dotted line here. It's the only way you'll return economic conservatism to the Republican Party. They lost that about 50 years ago.

Lets see here, the 89th Congress which would be 1968 when LBJ made those changes to the budget was, ta da, controlled by Democrats: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/89th_United_States_Congress

 

[faethor]

Except it wasn't Reagan who did that. What a shocker huh? Who did this dastardly deed against the old people? Why it was LBJ:

Umm yes it was.
The golden age of the American middle class is 1940-1982. It was in 1982 when Reagan removed the 70% tax on the wealthy. Along with Greenspan they sold America that Social Security was going to go bust soon and they needed to nearly double the associated payroll tax. It was with tax that was to be saved for the Baby Boomers retirement. Instead Reagan promptly borrowed it to reduce his massive spending increases. It was this massive theft of SS funds that Reagan did, not LBJ. And not so surprising we see the start of the slide of middle-class in the USA.

 

[Fade]

Faethor bluffed:
"It was in 1982 when Reagan removed the 70% tax on the wealthy."
------------------------------------

Time for Faethor to go back to school!

The Constitution grants the United States House of Representatives the exclusive power to initiate all revenue bills. For you folks in Canada and Europe, that means increases, or cuts, in taxes.

If Faethor had not cut classes the day they taught US History at his school, he would have known this.

I guess he was also out sick for the whole eight years that Reagan was president, otherwise he would know who was in charge of the House of Representatives for the whole time Reagan was president.

1972 Democrats, led by Carl Albert.
1974 Democrats, led by Carl Albert.
1976 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1978 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1980 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1982 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1984 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1986 Democrats, led by Jim Wright.
1988 Democrats, led by Jim Wright.
1990 Democrats, led by Tom Foley.
1992 Democrats, led by Tom Foley.

Oh Yeah, for you libs that like to brag about Clinton's term, remember this, Republicans led the House 6 of his 8 years in office.

 

[FluffyMcDeath]

I guess he was also out sick for the whole eight years that Reagan was president, otherwise he would know who was in charge of the House of Representatives for the whole time Reagan was president.

1980 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1982 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1984 Democrats, led by Tip Oneal.
1986 Democrats, led by Jim Wright.

So .... wait, what? You're saying that it was Democrats who cut taxes, not Reagan?

 

[Fade]

Strange isn't it. Couldn't have been done without them.
But with interest rates running at 17 to 19%, they saw the handwriting on the wall.

 

[faethor]

Faethor bluffed:
"It was in 1982 when Reagan removed the 70% tax on the wealthy."

The Constitution grants the United States House of Representatives the exclusive power to initiate all revenue bills. For you folks in Canada and Europe, that means increases, or cuts, in taxes.

If Faethor had not cut classes the day they taught US History at his school, he would have known this.

Of course I know this. The Congress passes the budget but the Buck Stops at the President's desk as they approve or veto accordingly. It's a bit like sports. Often the pitcher or quarterback gets the 'win' or 'loss' but it is a team effort.

I'd like to extend this idea to another thread. That a prediction of Obama failing and jobs losses beginning again. It appears the first 2 years under the Democratic Congress things were looking up. If things really begin failing I'm sure you'll credit the 2010 election and leadership of Republicans from this point on correct?