The Whyzzat Star Wars thread

[redrumloa]

I think this deserves it's own thread. Remember when I posted this?

As bad as the audience score is, it's a lie. Rotten Tomatoes doesn't count audience reviews under 20%, they throw them out. The actual true score is somewhere around 24%.

That video is only about 10 minutes long. I recommend you watch it. There is a rant at the end which is epic.

 

[Kesa]

They are doing the same thing with the new movie Solo. They are bringing in biased reviewers 2 weeks before the movie's release.

 

[redrumloa]

They are doing the same thing with the new movie Solo. They are bringing in biased reviewers 2 weeks before the movie's release.

It is very clear that all of the "critics" for Last Jedi were nothing more than paid shills afraid to lose their access to Disney. 91% Critic score for Last Jedi? Gone With The Wind has a 92%. You are correct that it seems the same thing is happening with Solo. The early reactions from critics who saw the screening all seem to be reading from the same general script. They throw in a tiny criticism they try to minimize, but then heap of praise using the same language of "it is a blast". They were given their marching orders, and they bent over and took them.

I hope I am wrong, but I fear Solo will be an even bigger train wreck than Last Jedi. The biggest theory out there right now that sounds plausible, is that Han Solo isn't even the main character in this movie. The brand new female lead will be the lead and Han Solo will play a supporting role. Solo will start off the movie as weak and bumbling, but by the end the female lead trained him to be competent. The famous "Kessel Run" will turn out to not have been performed by Solo himself, rather the female lead.

 

[redrumloa]

There was a young-ish person on FB politely asking why so many people so passionately hated TLJ. He was asking for genuine replies. I replied and when I was done I realized how long it was, so I will repost here. Do you agree?

Not a knock, just an observation. You are young. You probably don't really know movies in general except what Hollywood has pumped out over the last decade. I'm not saying you haven't seen the original triology on DVD/Bluray at some point, but even those had already been bastardized by Lucas himself. 2 points below.

1) Hollywood in general is pumping out almost nothing but complete garbage. There are a small number of exceptions. Disney (MCU) actually has a better track record in general than the rest of Hollywood, but what they are doing with Star Wars is horrifying. Other parts of the world are making movies infinitely better than Hollywood these days on fractions of a typical Hollywood movie budget. Check out just about any South Korean movie over the last 20 years. I can recommend some if needed.

2) To understand the passion of the hardcore fans, you kind of had to be around when the original trilogy came out. They weren't just movies, they were a cultural phenomena. Nowadays you can find niche communities that are very passionate for things like Magic The Gathering, Twilight fans, Anime fans etc. They are small groups, but they can be rabidly fanatic. The original Star Wars Trilogy was the same way, but on a scale unprecedented to this day.

The mythos and attention to detail was so deep and so complete it created a following that has never and probably will never be recreated. It didn't mater if you were a male teenage geek, or an average middle aged housewife, the story sucked you in and you talked about it for years. The characters were deep. Their character arcs developed over 3 films and 6 years before their climax. They were flawed characters who struggled to reach their goals.

Now? You have characters like Rey with no back story and no training who beats the new main villain in the her first movie on her first attempt. She beats a Jedi Master (Luke Skywalker) halfway through her second movie, still with no training. She also has a battle in the movie where she flawlessly performs Matrix type moves, still with no training. She's a "Mary Sue" character.

There are too many flaws with TLJ to mention here. I will say, research what "vacuum of space" is, but will stop there. I won't even get into detail how there is an openly admitted political agenda to the movie. I just mention all of this to contrast the lazy writing of SW today under Disney compared to the original trilogy. One was very detail oriented and extremely well thought out and implemented. The other was lazily put together in some corporate echo chamber at Disney just trying to check off boxes of diversity, visual effects, etc etc etc. Actual things like plot, overall mythos, character depth etc were an afterthought if a thought at all.

There is a saying these days that goes something like "Hollywood isn't about making good movies, it is about making money".

 

[ilwrath]

Personally, I didn't think TLJ was all that bad, as movies go, nowadays. Sure, it had issues... Some really big issues... But, at least it had some original bits. Which is a lot more than many movies I've seen recently. They were daring. In the process, they pissed off a lot of people. Turns out, it was the wrong movie for the wrong time.

We haven't stretched this all and warped it nearly enough. What we need here is a food analogy. There's an ice cream joint up the street. Only open during the summer. Freakin' awesome soft-serve cones. Swear they somehow have crack in them. Plain as hell, simple, and you know they're terrible for you... But it's been a damn summer tradition for a generation or more. Place opens this spring, and only serves fresh fruit yogurt, now. In it's own right, it's pretty decent yogurt, and quite a bit healthier. What's the newspaper review going to look like, vs the locals' opinion?

Ok, I debated about deleting this part, but I'm leaving it. I'm not sure what knowing this will add to the discussion... But I have to ask a couple questions, because you've been all over the board on this.

1) Are/were you a Star Wars fan?
2) When was the last time you've objectively watched the original 3 movies?

I ask, because "Characters were deep"? "Very detail oriented and extremely well thought out and implemented"? Did we watch the same trilogy?

I totally agree that the first 3 movies were the perfect movies for their time, and were a lightning-in-a-bottle cultural phenomenon. But, seriously, it's Star Wars... Your comparisons with MtG, Twilight and Anime are on point.

 

[redrumloa]

1) Are/were you a Star Wars fan?

Yes, I was a big fan. To be clear, big fan as I I loved the movies. I did not buy thousands of dollars in merchandise, and I have never dressed up as a wookie or such nonsense. Despite their problems, I even enjoyed the prequels. I also enjoyed Rogue One the same. Force Awakens? Well admittedly I enjoyed it, despite seeing many flaws. I didn't see it as sh*tting all over the franchise. In hindsight, I suppose the warning signs were there.

2) When was the last time you've objectively watched the original 3 movies?

About 2 years ago. Pretty sure it was 2016. We sat with one of my sons and watched the 3. My friend has an original VHS box set of it which he brought over for me to rip to digital for him. The reason we did this is the original VHS box set has almost no changes. Everything after that had increasing meddling by Lucas. I bet many people forget how bad the first Blu-Ray release was. It had something like a 15% rating on Amazon.

I ask, because "Characters were deep"? "Very detail oriented and extremely well thought out and implemented"? Did we watch the same trilogy?

Yes, I don't think a fan would argue against it. Was it perfect? No, nothing is. Was it extremely well thought out and implemented? Yes, using the technology of the time. I'm guessing the last time you watched, you watched one of the later Lucas Bluray releases that butchered certain aspects and detracted from the original releases. A software pirate group about 5 years back got an original reel version of "A New Hope" and converted it to digital. If you search torrents you can probably still find it. I recommend watching that. I wish the same happened with Empire Strikes Back and Return Of The Jedi, but it didn't.

I totally agree that the first 3 movies were the perfect movies for their time, and were a lightning-in-a-bottle cultural phenomenon. But, seriously, it's Star Wars...

Yes seriously, it's Star Wars. The #1 movie franchise of all time, surviving to this day on nothing other than good will towards the original trilogy.

 

[redrumloa]

"Characters were deep"? "Very detail oriented and extremely well thought out and implemented"?

Let's expand this a little more. Let's compare just the main character from the original triology to the main character of the current trilogy.

Luke Skywalker:

• A bit of an awkward personality.
• Struggled to learn the force.
• Could barely lift tiny rocks with the force even after some extended training.
• Was impatient with his teacher.
• Lost his first battles, had to be saved.
• Took 3 films to be able to finally beat the villain, and even then not completely conventionally.

Rey:

• With no training beat the main villain on her first try, in the first movie.
• Still with no training in her second movie, beat a Jedi Master on her first try in a movie timeline of about 24 hours later.
• Able to do silly complex Matrix style moves a day after being a scavenger on desert planet.
• Able to lift the side of a mountain with the force with no training. Well, Luke spoke to her for about 5 minutes.
• Ancient Jedi books burned by Yoda because despite no training, Yoda states she has full control of the force.
• She's a "Mary Sue" character. Comes out of nowhere, perfect and without flaws. Completely unbeatable and no bad personality traits.

 

[Kesa]

I think i can relate to you and i think you are approaching this the wrong way.

I felt the same way with Star Trek and what JJ Abrams did with it. I felt betrayed and disgusted at what he and he goons did with my beloved Star Trek. For a while i was outspoken about how much i disliked it but then i came to the realisation that it doesn't really matter if i like it or not. If i don't like it i can simply not watch it. Even if i think the new Trek is crap i still have the Star Trek i fell in love with and it will always be there. Maybe you should do the same.

As for the young fans being introduced to the Star Wars universe for the first time through the Kennedy movies just let them go and let them enjoy it. It's really none of your business.

Star Trek for me has always been about me and no one else. I don't care about the other fans. You should do the same and love Star Wars for yourself.

 

[redrumloa]

I think i can relate to you and i think you are approaching this the wrong way.

I felt the same way with Star Trek and what JJ Abrams did with it. I felt betrayed and disgusted at what he and he goons did with my beloved Star Trek. For a while i was outspoken about how much i disliked it but then i came to the realisation that it doesn't really matter if i like it or not. If i don't like it i can simply not watch it. Even if i think the new Trek is crap i still have the Star Trek i fell in love with and it will always be there. Maybe you should do the same.

As for the young fans being introduced to the Star Wars universe for the first time through the Kennedy movies just let them go and let them enjoy it. It's really none of your business.

Star Trek for me has always been about me and no one else. I don't care about the other fans. You should do the same and love Star Wars for yourself.

I think you miss the point of this thread. They aren't attracting a new generation. That may be what they are aiming for, but the fact is Lucasfilm is spiraling towards insolvency. The only people talking up how great this new direction is, are hardened SJW. Their numbers are small and they don't spend a lot of money. Most of them talking it up haven't even gone to theater to watch it.

Star Wars toys have literally hit Dollar Stores near me. Yup, Star Wars action figures for $1.00 on the shelf yet collecting dust. That has never happened before on this franchise. The demise of the market for Star Wars toys is what finally tipped Toys R Us to Chapter 7 Bankruptcy.

I can't speak for Star Trek as I really can't call myself a fan outside of some appreciation for the original campy 60s tv show, mainly for the campiness.

 

[redrumloa]

It's a shame I have to bring politics into a thread about Star Wars, but by the very top of Lucasfilms themselves, politics is all Star Wars is about. If you haven't been paying attention and want citations for this, I can dig them up easily.

Anyhow, in case you missed it, the "actor" who plays the newly re-imagined pansexual Lando Calrissian made an extremely SJW based violent music video to promote Solo. The video itself has not been censored by Youtube. Anyone criticizing it OTOH is censored.

https://twitter.com/x/status/996698942942347265

I said it before I'll say it again, poor George Lucas must be rolling in his grave. My prediction is that Solo completely and utterly tanks. Not just the movie, but the franchise in general. It won't reach $1B worldwide, meaning it won't earn back it's budget. There are 2 sequels planned, a Lando movie and others. They will all get scrapped. We may or may not get Episode 9 in a year or so, but after that the franchise will go into hibernation.

 

[Speelgoedmannetje]

It's a shame I have to bring politics into a thread about Star Wars, but by the very top of Lucasfilms themselves, politics is all Star Wars is about. If you haven't been paying attention and want citations for this, I can dig them up easily.

Anyhow, in case you missed it, the "actor" who plays the newly re-imagined pansexual Lando Calrissian made an extremely SJW based violent music video to promote Solo.

I just don't know what this means
I recently signed on on a dating site and all I see is "pansexual" or "sapiosexual". WHAT THE F does it MEAN? As I read it the first you screw literally anything, animate or inanimate, dead or alive, the universe with god inside out, and the latter as long as it's human, adult, underage or dead or whatever state it is in?

 

[adz]

I lost interest in Star Wars when I first saw The Phantom Menace...

 

[Speelgoedmannetje]

I lost interest in Star Wars when I first saw The Phantom Menace...

Yea me too! Being totally into Star Wars back then, after seeing that abomination in the cinema I wondered what I just saw. It was a big nothing.

 

[Kesa]

I just don't know what this means
I recently signed on on a dating site and all I see is "pansexual" or "sapiosexual". WHAT THE F does it MEAN? As I read it the first you screw literally anything, animate or inanimate, dead or alive, the universe with god inside out, and the latter as long as it's human, adult, underage or dead or whatever state it is in?

What dating site was it? I want to see.

 

[Kesa]

The Phantom Menace was actually the first Star Wars movie i saw. My younger and naive self loved it.

 

[Kesa]

The video itself has not been censored by Youtube. Anyone criticizing it OTOH is censored.

This is true that YouTube has an algorithm that scans uploaded videos and censors undesirable content.

 

[Speelgoedmannetje]

What dating site was it? I want to see.

OKCupid

 

[redrumloa]

On the subject of the original trilogy, as mentioned it is impossible to buy them in their original form. George Lucas tinkered worse and worse with each release. Luckily the very first movie that started it all was cleaned up and released by a pirate group online a couple years ago.

An Original Film Print of Star Wars Has Been Restored and Released Online

Whether or not you see George Lucas’ tinkering with the original Star Warstrilogy as harmless meddling or the greatest sin committed in cinematic history, it’s a shame that fans don’t even have the choice to purchase HD versions of the original theatrical cuts. But now, at least, a restored version of the first Star Wars is available online.

This isn’t a “despecialized edition” like many other fan attempts to revert Lucas’ changes. Somehow, a group of fans dubbing themselves Team Negative One found an original 35mm film print of the first Star Warsmovie,and have spent years cleaning it up, scanning each frame of film and digitally restoring it to make the cleanest version of the original movie as possible. You can check out a video comparing the state of the original film reel and the final, cleaned version below:

I got it at the time and it was worth the hype. I'd guess you could still get a torrent today. If not, I can probably find and send you a copy.

 

[adz]

And don't get me started with the changes they made to the original trilogy, substituting Hayden Christensen in Return of the Jedi was one of the worst things Lucas has ever done.

 

[redrumloa]

3 days until Solo premieres, and things don't seem to be trending well for it.

If you read through the critics scores, you can see a pattern of shillng. Despite the shilling, while The Last Jedi still got a 91%, Solo only got 66%. Many reviews still come off as shill reviews, but it seems they have hedged their shilling slightly. It must have been roundly embarrassing for them as a group to claim TLJ was one of the best movies of all time, only to have the actual audience hate it and call them out for their shillery. My prediction stands that this film will bomb, and the audience score will be south of 35%. It would be lower than that, but Rotten Tomatoes throws out viewer scores under 1 star (20%).

To recap what is known from critics.

1) Movie is shallow, a popcorn action flick at best.
2) Lando is re-imagined as pansexual and he has sex with his droid.
3) That droid is a feminist who is fighting for droid rights.
4) Solo and Chewie have an intimate shower scene, seriously.
5) Alden Ehrenreich (Solo) cannot act, he's a wood plank on screen.
6) Senior management at Lucasfilms are already blaming racism, sexism, homophobia and every other 'ism for lack of excitement about this movie.

The shill media are claiming this movie is going to break all sorts of records, especially opening weekend. I'm not buying it when not only are my local theaters not sold out 3 days in advance, but they look like ghost towns. Seriously, how embarrassing is this for a Star Wars movie in the blue county of Broward??

You will witness a train wreck next week when numbers are announced.