Wow!

Fade

Fade

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What a week.
Didn't think it could get any better, but the gifts just keep on coming.
Air America goes bust, ceases live programming.
Mass. Senate seat is reclaimed by the people, doesn't belong to Camelot.
Dems. super majority goes splat.
UN admits it was duped by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.
Government ramrod of healthcare dies of the uglies.
John Edwards stealing baby diapers, jail time maybe in his future.
America gets its freedom of speech back.
And now gnashing of teeth and hand wringing by MSM, Liberals, Progressives, Global Warmers, Democrats, Socialists, and Canadians.

Makes a body feel good!
 
Hurrah we get to check out if the Founding Fathers really did have the ability of prognostication!


I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."
-- Thomas Jefferson /Letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin (1802)


"When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
-- Benjamin Franklin


Besides the danger of a direct mixture of religion and civil government, there is an evil which ought to be guarded against in the indefinite accumulation of property from the capacity of holding it in perpetuity by ecclesiastical corporations.
-James Madison
 
faethor said:
Hurrah we get to check out if the Founding Fathers really did have the ability of prognostication!


I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."
-- Thomas Jefferson /Letter to the Secretary of the Treasury Albert Gallatin (1802)


"When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
-- Benjamin Franklin


Besides the danger of a direct mixture of religion and civil government, there is an evil which ought to be guarded against in the indefinite accumulation of property from the capacity of holding it in perpetuity by ecclesiastical corporations.
-James Madison
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Sounds like you should become a Ron Paul supporter pronto!
 
redrumloa said:
Sounds like you should become a Ron Paul supporter pronto!
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If Ron Paul wasn't so full of crap I might be.

Ron Paul talks about going back to the founding of the company. Abortion was legal. Ron Paul is against abortion. Corporations were limited lifespan and limited to a single product. Ron Paul appears to not want to go there. We could own slaves. Women couldn't vote. Interracial marriage was forbidden. Ron Paul appears to be against these. So what past does he want us to go to? Ron Paul's 'bring the USA to it's roots' is some idealized non-existent version of the past.

Here's a ticket I'd vote for -- Ron Paul + Bernie Sanders ... Where they agree might actually work out for the better. :wink:

Here's another oldie but goodie:
"I hope we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." Thomas Jefferson
 
Is that just an observation or an attack? I don't see any big deal here.
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More observation and a bit of amusement. A real attack would be silly.
 
faethor said:
redrumloa said:
Sounds like you should become a Ron Paul supporter pronto!
Click to expand...
If Ron Paul wasn't so full of crap I might be.
Click to expand...

Full of crap? No. If he was full of crap they would have given him more time on Fox News during the Republican primaries.
You may disagree with him - I disagree with him on quite a few things - but he isn't full of crap.

That said, I still prefer the likes of Gravel, Kucinich and Grayson.
 
Fade said:
America gets its freedom of speech back.
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Bribery is not exactly the same as free speech. Allowing a handful of corporations to out shout 300 million Americans is not the same thing as free speech. Fewer than 600 men can now rule America for their own benefit - and they aren't all American and even many of those who are, are internationalists. This has given foreigners a very big hand in deciding US policy by deciding who constitutes the government.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
That said, I still prefer the likes of Gravel, Kucinich and Grayson.
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I always liked what Kucinich had to say, whenever I've read or heard it.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Bribery is not exactly the same as free speech. Allowing a handful of corporations to out shout 300 million Americans is not the same thing as free speech. Fewer than 600 men can now rule America for their own benefit - and they aren't all American and even many of those who are, are internationalists. This has given foreigners a very big hand in deciding US policy by deciding who constitutes the government.
Click to expand...
Fortune 500 companies made $650Billion in profits last year. The 2008 elections netted nationwide cost $2.5Billion. 1% of profits from 500 is nearly 3x the money. This is more then enough to pursuade nation, state, local, and school board elections.

And yes you're right there is no exception for foreign companies. Do we want money money from BP, Shell, Toyota, Honda, Bayer, AstraZenica buying politicans?

The question is where to put the blame. Bush for appointing the Supreme Court? Sandra Day O'Conner for voting in GW against the constitution? Reagan for appointing O'Conner?

And why no 'judical activist' out cries from the Corpublicans? Because that's only cried if they don't win.
 
metalman said:
Obama supporters "letters to editor" campaign shows tremendous support for Obama!!.
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We have some here who love conspiracies so I'll throw one out for them. Really this is frustrated Republicans writting letters. They are then calling out their own campaign as questionable. They hope this will further discredit the President. Why? Cuz they hate America. (IMO more beliveable then 8' tall hairy ape-men hidden from society and still in existence around the world.)
 
metalman said:
Obama supporters "letters to editor" campaign shows tremendous support for Obama!!

:roflmao:
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Sounds like a fan who is just exercising her right to free speech. The fake address subterfuge was what she likely thought necessary to get the letter carried and she is probably right.

I suspect it is a single person (as she claims) rather than a campaign because it lack the sophistication of a campaign. Generally letter writing campaigns have more resources behind them so tend not to recycle the same text and senders name. They will use "talking points", of course, but wouldn't likely repeat text wholesale as they would hire more writers.

It is an interesting study in how one person can disseminate an opinion farther than most people ever try.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
metalman said:
faethor a/k/a "Ellie Light"
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Unlikely for at least two reasons.
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Ellie Light is probably Samantha Powers

An "Ellie" is a national magazine award for journalists.
Ellie is journalism slang for L.E., or Letter to Editor .
"Ellie" writes in the boilerplate of an "astroturf" campaigner.

USA Today printed another Ellie Light letter today. Ellie provided a Long Beach, CA, address, the same town used on an Ellie Light letter published in the Washington Times.

47 newspapers in 23 states have now been found that published letters from Ellie Light, each claiming a phony address. Including the USA Today, Washington Post and politico.com.

This paper actually published her letter 3 times in the same week. Each time under a different address.

1
2
3

-- even one in Thailand!
here is her posting in the Bangkok Post on 1/17.

Ellie Light is using a dummy mail server.

Ellie" is Barrack's nickname for Michelle Obama. Barrack Obama has refered to his wife in the past as his "Light".

Samantha Power worked for Senator Barack Obama and was part of on his presidential campaign. Samantha Power is married to Cass Sunstein who works in the Obama administration as Administrator of the White House Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs.

While at Harvard Law School, Sunstein co-wrote a paper proposing that the U.S. Government employ teams of covert agents and pseudo-"independent" advocates to "cognitively infiltrate" online groups and websites.

Then there is this article from last fall
Eric Holder has apparently hired former Democratic campaign bloggers to work at the department in what appears to be a secret propaganda unit.

and this from Salon:
Obama confidant's spine-chilling proposal

Ellie Light Twitter account

faethor is probably Ellie Light's twitter friend though

Update: It's now "63 publications in 29 states and the District of Columbia
 
metalman said:
"Ellie" writes in the boilerplate of an "astroturf" campaigner.
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If it's astroturf is a pretty darned lame and cheap campaign -

Real astroturf's objective is to look like a grass roots campaign. It is usually run by a professional PR company with a sizable staff. Reusing the same name over and over would be the opposite of what is desired - to make the position seem like a popular position you would use many names and many writers.

This lack of sophistication leaves me thinking it's a zealous individual.

"Ellie" is Barrack's nickname for Michelle Obama. Barrack Obama has refered to his wife in the past as his "Light".
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The "L.E." theory I would actually buy - this one about Michelle is a stretch.

While at Harvard Law School, Sunstein co-wrote a paper proposing that the U.S. Government employ teams of covert agents and pseudo-"independent" advocates to "cognitively infiltrate" online groups and websites.
Click to expand...

Then there is this article from last fall
Eric Holder has apparently hired former Democratic campaign bloggers to work at the department in what appears to be a secret propaganda unit.
Click to expand...

This is not new. Where have you been for the last decade. The US military has people blogging for it and sending letters to the editor and creating news stories, the CIA does it, the Israeli military and other militaries must surely do it too. The Republican party does it and industry does it. Under Bush every peace group in the country was crawling with agents.

This is not in defensive of such surveillance and propaganda but I don't think Ellie is this. It looks too small time and even the message is really soft, not the kind of thing I'd expect from professionals.

But since you didn't seem to notice when "your team" was astroturfing and propagandizing perhaps this will help you see it the next time your team does it.
 
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