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I've posted organ stealing stories about Kosovo too. A bit of an abomination when those things happen - unless Jews do it, I'm sorry. I have to take into account how we can't hold them to the same standards as other people because of how their parents suffered (uniquely I might add because no-one else suffers as much).If I remember correctly it had something to do with organ stealing and some Israelis. It was the sort of story that was rather unremarkable, it was posted on it's own thread for no apparent reason and the only interesting thing about it was that it was posted by you and that it involved jews.
Then I must have misread where you were going with your comment. You seemed to be implying that people who criticise Israel were biased. Or were you just saying that you can be a Jew hater and criticize Israel but people who don't hate Jews criticize Israel as well? In which case, what's to defend? Everybody can criticize so how does criticism make you a hater - unless it crosses what you're comfortable with after which you call it bias and then just decide - must be a Jew hater. Nice bit of wiggle room it seems you have left yourself.Have I made such a claim?
On matters of importance to Israel, like when they feel like having a war on their neighbours or other matters in the middle east like Iraq, and if the powers that be are their guys (which is not as much the case under Obama) then the US dances to the tune. Even under Obama it's hard to say "We condemn the disproportionate response in Gaza" or "the settlements are illegal under international law and must be stopped and reversed" or the highly non controversial "the wall is a land grab". No US politician can do that. In fact congress just voted to give Israel a half a billion dollars to help them with the burden of killing Arabs. But on other matters like rolling back Russia (possibly to the point of war) and pushing back China - that's USA stuff, but if Israel could lend a hand with that it would go some ways to greasing the skids when it comes to stuff like ... voting for money for Israel and not being too critical about killing Arabs.Yes, but... You kinda have made it clear in the past how you feel that the US jumps only exactly how high Israel tells it to jump. So are you now trying to convince me that you hate the puppet and not the puppet master?
Like I said, it could be accomplished by less than twenty guys considering the assets under control. It would be a ridiculously simple operation for a capable intelligence agency. The far more complicated part would be the media effort to capitalize on it. And it isn't far from this that have been done before.It sounds like you're talking about a movie or a game. Sorry, I didn't really think along the lines of fantastical plots.
That would be because you are a delusional tinfoil hat wearing crank. Now why don't you come up with a stupid theory of creation too by way of disproving evolution. You see, the way it works is, just because you say something stupid doesn't mean anybody else did. Maybe you don't see that.In that case then my favorite would be that Typhon finally escaped from his prison under Mount Aetna and boarded flight MH17 to take a vacation in the far east (like all good multitentacled monsters do these days). Zeus would have none of that and thus shot the plane down with a flurry of lightning bolts. Typhon was ripped to peaces and scattered around the crash site. To help cover up the incident the Pro-Russian rebels decided to quickly dispense with the body parts and tamper with the crash site to remove all evidence.
Well, that proves .... what, exactly?
' "Ukrainian Prosecutor-General Vitaly Yarema told Ukrainian Pravda newspaper on Friday.Yes, the flight wasn't on the normal flight path. However, to say that the air space was closed is not quite accurate. Air space is three dimensional, and by that I mean it has a height factor. MH17 was considerably above the closed portion of the air space. It was believed that anything above a certain altitude was safe because it was assumed that no one was firing medium range SAMs.
Putin has better knowledge of what Kiev has and how tasty a target he would be for them since members of the Kiev government have publicly called for his murder (and the rest of the Russians too, of course). Of course, there is the little wrinkle that if he had been flying over and been shot at he would have to deny it. It he had been shot at he would pretty much have to respond and that would mean war, which Putin cannot afford at the moment, something he is trying to avoid. If he was being nice enough not to mention it, I'm sure Washington and Kiev would honour that and refrain from publishing any information that would show he had in fact been shot at by Kiev. That's not to say he did fly over - as I said before, Kiev wants to kill him too much and they have Buk systems that could reach him so it would be foolhardy.Putin obviously has better knowledge as to what weapons the rebels have and what they're shooting at, so of coarse he wouldn't fly over Ukraine.
Yes, but this was so exciting for them. But, you see, Obama and his guys are mostly not neo-cons. That's what makes it just so annoying. It used to be easy for them. They could funnel the propaganda mostly to the president and then leverage the president to rally the nation. These days they have to launch massive propaganda at the public and hope that public pressure will force the presidents hand (and if not now, then at least at election time). See the mockery of Obama's inability to start a war even with such good excuses as poison as and aircraft shoot downs. It's true they are burning up inside.Neocons are frustrated more than anyone.
NATO has already extended non-ally membership to Ukraine and Georgia and a few others. That's a territorial expansion. Yes, not enough for the neo-cons of course, but still an increase in the US security regime.NATO isn't gonna do a darned thing here, the most we can expect are a few more sanctions.
Why don't you do us all a favor and jump off a bridge.
I'm sorry that I didn't jump to your preferred conclusions. I have been watching this build for a long time - since before the coup in Kiev. Putin isn't dumb and I'd peg him a couple of steps down from our guys in the evil department though I'm happy to admit that may only be out of political necessity. Who knows what kind of monster he'd be if he had the power our guys have.Why don't you do us all a favor and jump off a bridge.
I fully believe it was an accident as not much good would come from an intentional downing from either side. Most articles support this, the only ones who claim otherwise are Ukrainian propaganda and they're over the top crazy too but luckily most western media just ignores that.
I spent some time calculating the probability of who fired the missile. I am a physicist in the nuclear industry, but find doing such calculations at times rewarding. I used the basic information from Wikpedia such as ranges and speeds. I did round off to make it simpler, but usually did so to make the probabilites of success BETTER than they usually are.
The Buk missile system has a maximum kill distance of
about 24 miles. The more horizontal the
target from the launch the further it is effective and the more vertical the
target the distance reduces to 15.5 miles maximum. With a target at over 6 miles high as the
Malaysia flight was, the maximum intercept distance would be about 19 miles However your probability of success drops to
5% at that distance and obviously you want a higher probability of success to
be 90% or better which is at 12 to 13 miles.
Since the jet was at over 6 miles high, that means the jet would have to
be within 10 horizontal miles of the launcher at the time the missile
hits. It would take 18 to 22 seconds for
the missile to travel that far. Since
the jet is traveling at 880 feet per second and the travel time is an average
of 20 seconds the jet would travel about 3 miles during the missiles travel
time. Thus if you fired at the jet as it
approached you could do so 3 miles further way making the effective range back
out to 15 to 16 miles. But this same
advantage of increasing the range when the target is approaching, also is a
disadvantage if the target is already passed you and increasing it's
range. Thus using the same formula, the
distance you can shoot a target passed you is 9 to 10 miles or the probability
of success quickly goes to 0. Per the
radar data the jet was struck 31 miles from the Russian border.
So who shot the jet down? Well since the rebels supported by Russia
controls most of the eastern part of Ukraine, the Ukrainians would have to have
a missile launcher within 40 to 41 miles of the Russian Border which is about
how far Donetsk is from the Russian border and this area and about 40 miles to
the west of it has no Ukrainian military assets. The Rebels control this area.
CONCLUSION:.
The missile that struck the jet was fired from north and east of Donetsk
in a Westward trajectory. The missile
could not have been fired from the Kiev controlled region. Mathematically impossible
In somber ceremony, Dutch welcome home first remains of MH17 victims
one of the comments someone made is kinda interesting.
I agree, people who claim things like that I tend to be rather skeptical of. People with real creds tend to make their own blog and post stuff like that there. This was posted on an article that wasn't really even focused on the blame game. Still, it at least gives us something to think about, specifically, that we may be able to use math to guide us back to reality. Of course using math requires all the right variables and algorithms, but we should have all of that available - we just gotta do it.For someone who claims to be a nuclear physicist, I would certainly agree that his use of the term "mathematically impossible" is "interesting".
In an interview with Reuters, Alexander Khodakovsky, commander of the Vostok Battalion, acknowledged for the first time since the airliner was brought down in eastern Ukraine on Thursday that the rebels did possess the BUK missile system and said it could have been sent back subsequently to remove proof of its presence.
Before the Malaysian plane was shot down, rebels had boasted of obtaining the BUK missiles, which can shoot down airliners at cruising height. But since the disaster the separatists' main group, the self-proclaimed People’s Republic of Donetsk, has repeatedly denied ever having possessed such weapons.
I never forgot. I thought that you might have forgotten that we at least had that agreement, being that the post I was responding to was so ... emotional?You write several lines building up a straw man about how I think evil Putin ordered the shoot down and then remember that I already stated that I believe it was an accident.
Yes, that is what you say. Information that does not agree with the western version as pushed through the State Department and the press is propaganda. And yet, when Kerry complains of the drunken mishandling of bodies and the belligerence of the rebels not letting everyone flood into the territory they have been fighting and dying to defend ... and how Putin is responsible etc, that's not propaganda, but when one of our guys who goes and fetches the bodies says he thinks they did a good job in difficult conditions, that must be Russian propaganda. The western reports could hardly be more obviously emotional manipulation, do you not even hear the language they use? Personifying a country as it's leader is what we do when we are beating the drums. It was never the government of Iraq we dealt with but Saddam Saddam Saddam. It's part of the rhetoric. People find it hard to hate countries and institutions, too esoteric. That's why we use human targets. That's just part of the literary evidence for what is going on.However it's you that takes Russian propaganda and posts it here as if it's something we should seriously consider.
Putin quickly officially denied that first one. The second he probably feels should not be dignified with any comment, lest it end up sticking to him. In fact that one seems to have started as an off-handed comment perhaps from someone who doesn't realize how quickly bodies can go off in the heat.Btw, the Russians are throwing out a bunch of different theories, many of which are clearly contradictory. First it was a plot to shoot down Putin's plane, next we the plane was full of dead bodies before take off.
Maybe to events as you've been told them. Or, more likely from what I have seen and heard in our press, fact free innuendo and rhetorical gimmicks - kind of like the lead-up to Iraq, like saying Saddam and 911 within the same sentence, just because. In a few years, if we're still around, go pick up a paper from a few days ago and read it with some detachment.You seem to love this technique as well as you love to post various different conspiracy theories which are often contradictory to actual events or to themselves with the probable goal of making people doubt all explanations including the official one.
There ARE only two warring side - Russia and the US. Lot's of player on the ground with their own agendas, hoping to carve a little something out of the mayhem but that is the nature of proxy wars. And most hilariously the US talks about arming the moderates. Here's a clue for you. The moderates are the ones who don't have and don't want to take up arms. And they exist, and they were on the streets at the beginning, and they have denounced the armed fighters that we arm and train.That's why you keep talking about the Syria conflict as if there are only two warring sides.
(This is a bit of an aside but interesting psychology).If Russia and the pro-Russians came out and admitted it and offered compensation and any assistance I'd have some level of respect for them.
They seem to have handled it not entirely terribly considering the enormous pressure they've been under. They are being attacked and are trying to defend their little chunk of turf and are wary of ceding ground - but nonetheless, while under attack they have managed to recover the bodies and let inspectors into the site and they have now turned over the black boxes (despite rumours that they had sent them to Moscow - which, for all we know they may have and then got them back. You could understand why Russia might want to make a backup before letting them go). Many of Kerry's nasty things he said about how the rebels handled things seem to be just cheap shots. Every indication is that they are cooperating - but now I hear much consternation that ... what was the head line? ... something about indications that the airplane was sawed in half!!! Think of the fun the Russian press could have with that headline. But read on and the story becomes less and less of a thing. So why the outrageous headline? To catch eyes and leave the people who don't have much time to read stories with a very mistaken impression. Most people skim. It's a fact of our busy lives and exploitable for a quick psi-hack. Don't imagine that there isn't propaganda on both sides.But instead they do all they can to play politics with it and have only disgraced themselves with the horrible manner in which they handled the disaster.
The rebels have been labelled terrorists by Kiev almost immediately even though it was Kiev that was attacking and killing them and they were the defenders. There is a war of words, painting the opponent as sub-human. Would you believe that they were baby eating vermin. Probably not, that's a bit WWII. But saying that the rebels basically desecrated our dead - that's an emotional hook you can sink pretty deep. That's the sort of thing that slides right by the critical faculties. There have been rumours in the western press also that bodies had been stolen. Kerry actually complained that the bodies were being removed from the location - presumably he wanted them left there to rot rather than to be returned.The Ukrainians of the East harassed first in responders while in a drunken stooper.