47%ers and Mitt

robert l. bentham said:
lol... not fast enough for ya? way to tow the party line red, your bitch boy mcain thinks they should stay there forever, or at least until the oil runs out....
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I did not vote for McCain. I feel bad for you, so clueless:(
 
cecilia said:
he's doing everything legal and my brother doesn't have offshore accounts that he can hide his money in
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I don't mean that. A good tax accountant knows all the ins and outs of tax law. Tax law and the IRS is a complete joke. It is nearly impossible for Joe SixPack to navigate tax law by himself. I have used a good tax accountant for the last ~15 years. It costs me about ~$180/year and is money very well spent. I think the current tax code and IRS is completely broken but there is nothing I can do about it but play the game within the current rules.
 
metalman said:
Chains_Poster_Occupy.png
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Ok, let's go over this again. The slaves pick the cotton. The plantation owner sells the cotton and keeps the money and provides the slaves with just enough "income" in terms of food to keep them alive and productive.
Who is creating the wealth, who is leeching off of whom?
 
faethor said:
Second, monies are taxed unequally. Money from investments are taxed less than money from physical labor. No matter how the wealth was acquired tax it at the same rate. Let's see what that does for the next 4 years then take it from there.
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Adam Smith was of the opinion that income from labour should not be taxed but income from rent should be (as unearned income). All investment income is rental income. Of course, if taxes were done that way then the rich would pay themselves wages instead of collect interest and dividends. Same tax for all income seems like a good middle ground.
 
redrumloa said:
I was a fan of Steve Forbes flat tax years back. You know how many billions could be saved by eliminating the IRS? Of course dems would cry about the lost gov jobs. Everyone should pay a flat percentage, preferably as a sales tax.
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Why as a sales tax? The poor spend just about all of their income or even more than their income, often living on credit, while the rich do the lending and end up having more money than they can spend. What that would mean is that the poor would pay more taxes on every dollar of income than the rich would. How is that flat? Income should be taxed, not spending. Spending is what drives the economy and why would you want to penalize the job creators (the true job creators are the consumers because if no-one is buying anything then no company needs to hire people - kind of like what's happening now).
 
redrumloa said:
I don't mean that. A good tax accountant knows all the ins and outs of tax law. Tax law and the IRS is a complete joke. It is nearly impossible for Joe SixPack to navigate tax law by himself. I have used a good tax accountant for the last ~15 years. It costs me about ~$180/year and is money very well spent. I think the current tax code and IRS is completely broken but there is nothing I can do about it but play the game within the current rules.
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And pester politicians and join with like minded people who are politically active and work to properly vet and put forward for election decent candidates by joining your preferred party and showing up to vote candidates and delegates and to actively pester and even undermine intransigent party bosses and setting up the strategic alliances and legal structures to allow you to be able to do that ...
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Why as a sales tax? The poor spend just about all of their income or even more than their income, often living on credit, while the rich do the lending and end up having more money than they can spend. What that would mean is that the poor would pay more taxes on every dollar of income than the rich would. How is that flat? Income should be taxed, not spending. Spending is what drives the economy and why would you want to penalize the job creators (the true job creators are the consumers because if no-one is buying anything then no company needs to hire people - kind of like what's happening now).
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There would be no loopholes for the wealthy and we all know the wealthy like to spend. You would collect a buttload more than before and the overhead of the IRS would be gone. As for the "poor" actually having to pay taxes, so be it. The current system of reverse taxation is unsustainable, period. It is not about helping people, it is about eliminating the middle class and creating a 2 class system of the the 99% ultra poor dependent on the government for everything and the 1% elite. Once everyone is dependent, the culling of the masses will begin.
 
redrumloa said:
There would be no loopholes for the wealthy and we all know the wealthy like to spend.
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well should we look and see how those rich folks like to spend... the mittster drop 70 some grand on a dancing, prancing horse. then he wrote it off on his taxes... so you and i bought that dildo a horsey... remember under bush... he gave tax credits to people who bought hummers... but hey the federal government is broke and in debt... damn red... you really are a tool... sad, sad, little man :rolleyes:
 
redrumloa said:
That really is an amazing amount of donations. I bet that 4 million did a lot, unlike federal income tax that goes into the great void.
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Well, let's see. More than half of it went to his church, Church of Latter Day Saints - so that is mostly his tithes to help the Mormon Elders live in the lifestyle to which they have become accustomed and also to help with the ministry and conversion of people to Mormonism. Plenty of worthwhile stuff happening for that money.

A bunch more money he gave "charitably" to a foundation he seems to run that gave money to worthy causes such as the Friends of George W Bush Library (plus some other Mormon charities). So, how charitable are these charitable givings? Just a way to move money among friend tax free?

On the other hand, if Romney's millions had gone to taxes that would be a few days of occupying Afghanistan that he would have paid for instead of you having to pay for it.
 
redrumloa said:
There would be no loopholes for the wealthy and we all know the wealthy like to spend.
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Please don't use conjunctions if it is going to lead to saying more than one stupid thing in a single sentence.

Last thing first, the rich don't like to spend. For the most part they buy slightly more expensive versions of the things that we buy but the rich generally are quite stingy, it's one of the things that makes them rich - they love to nickle and dime you.

One thing the wealthy get is a lot of freebies. People are always trying to curry favour with the wealthy. I suppose technically these gifts and deals would be considered a type of income but it won't count as a sale.

The types of things that are ridiculously expensive, like sports teams or yachts would be held by companies controlled by the wealthy instead of personally and if personally then the trades would likely be done in other jurisdictions. You want a new yacht? You buy it in the jurisdiction with the lowest sales taxes - or you do it through a charitable foundation or some other agency that would be too expensive for your average Joe buying a beater but is very cost effective for the rich. You don't seem to understand what kind of money the rich have. It's not just a bit more than you, Red, it's hundreds of thousands of times more.

You would collect a buttload more than before and the overhead of the IRS would be gone.
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Sales tax needs an agency to keep track of the tax and there are far more sales events than payroll events. The amount of bureaucracy and book keeping overhead for sellers is huge, far bigger than what's needed for income tax.

As for the "poor" actually having to pay taxes, so be it. The current system of reverse taxation is unsustainable, period.
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What do you mean "reverse" taxation? You mean the more you make the bigger your tax break? Sure, that's wrong but somehow I don't think that's what you meant.

It is not about helping people, it is about eliminating the middle class and creating a 2 class system of the the 99% ultra poor dependent on the government for everything and the 1% elite. Once everyone is dependent, the culling of the masses will begin.
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The current drive for tax changes is to make it easier for the 1% to take all the wealth and harder for the 99% to get their money back from them.
 
redrumloa said:
I don't mean that. A good tax accountant knows all the ins and outs of tax law. Tax law and the IRS is a complete joke. It is nearly impossible for Joe SixPack to navigate tax law by himself. I have used a good tax accountant for the last ~15 years. It costs me about ~$180/year and is money very well spent. I think the current tax code and IRS is completely broken but there is nothing I can do about it but play the game within the current rules.
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he's got a good accountant.

what you don't get is that the system is geared toward the rich so they stay rich, not the middle class - who become poor
 
@lawsonry
Blood Drives=blood entitlement programs. Lazy bleeders want blood handouts, while the rest of America builds their own blood.

:lol:
 
robert l. bentham said:
I was an Infantry Platoon Leader in Iraq and I lost a Bradley Fighting Vehicle on 24 JAN 2005, killing 5 of the 7 guys in it. This picture was taken during a memorial ceremony on our base after the event. 47% of these guys also had an entitlement mentality...

:finger: mitt romney
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"47 percent of Americans pay no income taxes and are dependent on government” -Romney

Clearly you're an idiot if you think Romney was talking about those serving our country as having an "entitlement mentality"

:finger:

too many Democratic voters feel entitled to free goodies provided by the government and financed by taxpayers.


That mentality is why so many are falling for this scam
 
metalman said:
"47 percent of Americans pay no income taxes and are dependent on government” -Romney

Clearly you're an idiot if you think Romney was talking about those serving our country as having an "entitlement mentality"

:finger:

too many Democratic voters feel entitled to free goodies provided by the government and financed by taxpayers.



That mentality is why so many are falling for this scam
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sorry my friend.. here's the scam you're not seeing... that 47 million people number has been bandied about much lately and guess where it comes from? it's that abysmal number of americans receiving food stamps... oh sure they get social security too, but thats a different number... but the 47 million includes them.. it includes walmart employees, soldiers, some firefighters, and in some small communities teachers. handicap, seniors (yes ur mother if not now, then when social security wont cover the costs of a retirement with dignity because republicans looted it again),the disabled, and the unfortunate who for whatever reason cant seem to find work... itd surprise to know how many of the homeless are "papered" professionals... so f'in what.... grow up... i paid into that fund its not an entitlement, its an earned benefit, had you put it in a lock box when gore suggested this conversation would be moot at this very moment... but we didnt, for whatever reason and so it sits... teetered on the parapet of what was once its own solvency and now its bankruptcy... we built that... you and i my friend... through bad decision and neglect... but you would just smash the machine rather than improve on it... fix it, strengthen it... no... you.. you would dismantle the whole apparatus in your pious rage and you'd be left with all the glories of yesteryear. when our old froze in the streets. our mentally ill walked among us, harming themselves and unable to tend to their basic needs til they died from misfortune, huddled in a box in a back alley... red, m&m ?... you all so financially secure you can assure your family or even those you care about a dignified death for certain? if you can cudos... not all jobs pay that good but somebody has to do them "lowly" jobs too... u discount the janitor maybe, not realizing that they move about like ants cleaning surfaces that ill people touch in the grocery stores you buy food from... reality is, to me, that feller is more important than the store manager... he got that number from somewhere... and its the same "food stamp" number they been using to illustrate how "bad" things are...
 
Not Even Fox News Can Save Mitt Romney’s Sorry Sunday


John Dickerson (Face The Nation), ” I talked to a number of Republicans this week, one strategist who has been involved in a lot of these campaigns said when he saw that video it was the first time he thought he was seeing the real Romney. That’s a problem when your most troubled moment is the one people think is the most authentic moment.”
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Chris Hayes: Romney tapes reveal ‘plutocracy’ just ‘whining’ about everything
“Almost none of the advice Romney gets during the tape is very good. Some of it is terrible,” Hayes said, but that’s not the interesting part. The interesting part, he explained, is that “Unlike the millions of other political junkies and backseat drivers, this small coterie of folks by sole virtue of their wealth, gets to impose their invaluable insights on the actual candidate.”

“This is the power of money, not just in politics but in society more broadly: the power to make people listen to your ideas, no matter how dumb or uninformed,” Hayes said.

He added, “The other thing that stood out to me was just how under siege, persecuted and victimized these extremely wealthy people appear to feel,” he added. “And what you hear from them is the same kind of whining that was the central theme of the Republican convention.”
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