The wussification of the American Male continues

redrumloa

redrumloa

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Are You a Man? One Author Feels Your Changes

He said men’s relationships with their friends are shifting. “I think there is this idea that men don’t have friendships. Everything that I have seen in my life suggests that is a change that is happening,” he said. When Feiler was diagnosed with a rare form of bone cancer in 2008, he asked six friends if they would be father figures to his twin daughters, in the event of his death.

“In a way, it forced me to tell them what I really thought about them. And my wife would listen in to these conversations. And she would say it was almost as if I were ‘friend-marrying’ these guys. There were flowers and chocolates, the whole thing,” he laughed. “She said that the things that we were talking about in our most intimate moments, our feelings, our fears, even our weight, were exactly the things that the moms were talking about at drop-off. “
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BPA from plastic and estrogen in tap water?
 
Yup those good old days when men were men and sheep were scared...

Personally I don't care. People should strive to be what they want to be. If you don't want to care about your wedding or your kids and be all about the bros go do it! Heck we just had the family over and we split the chores, as we always do. I'm not boasting but reflecting that men's roles have changed. We don't have the 'Leave it Beaver' house where I go sit in the other room and smoke a pipe. I'd hate doing that. And you know what I'm happy and isn't that really the most important question?!
 
well... red is right...at least partially... i wish he wouldn't call it wussification... cause thats an incorrect nomenclature for what is actually happening to humans from the toxins...on the other hand... i never had a leave it to beaver life either... my parents made me pull my weight at an early age, because i had to(farm life offers cushy jobs to no one), and needed to(shouldn't you be able to cook and clean for yourself).
 
Wow. There are so many things wrong with this thread (well, just with the initial post that is).
 
redrumloa said:
BPA from plastic and estrogen in tap water?
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most of the "it's okay to talk about your feelings" is a direct result of psychiatry approaches deployed over the last 40 years, the 60's, and modern day TV. whether it's wussification or not i guess depends on if you happen to be sitting in a womens trauma group or a ptsd group at the VA. u might think it wimpy(wuss like) to see "grown men crying like girls" but i'd wager you and your better angels would keep that thought to yourself. is it better to be able to talk about stuff to your peers and the people you care about? i'm gonna say yes. i remember, as a guy, the added stress i felt having to keep all that inside. do we go to far? at times i know i do, i'm a human prone to much folly and subject to frailty...
 
meh. It's cultural, not chemical. Lot's of other cultures are more open about feelings, and some are less. However, it's also depends on relationships and the perceived competitiveness or cooperativeness of others. Under competitive conditions men will play their cards much closer to their chests, but where cooperation is required then openness is more favoured.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
meh. It's cultural, not chemical. Lot's of other cultures are more open about feelings, and some are less. However, it's also depends on relationships and the perceived competitiveness or cooperativeness of others. Under competitive conditions men will play their cards much closer to their chests, but where cooperation is required then openness is more favoured.
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meh... but.... no... we are little more than the culmination of our genetics and life experiences ... to downplay one in order to favour the other i think is somewhat disingenuous,coming from you, i think; given your level of understanding about "stuff"in general...
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
meh. It's cultural, not chemical. Lot's of other cultures are more open about feelings, and some are less. However, it's also depends on relationships and the perceived competitiveness or cooperativeness of others. Under competitive conditions men will play their cards much closer to their chests, but where cooperation is required then openness is more favoured.
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No, it is not just cultural and the "emotional" aspect is actually only one aspect. The more troubling aspect is the physical one. Sperm counts are way, way down. Physical appearance is without a doubt changing.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
meh. It's cultural, not chemical. Lot's of other cultures are more open about feelings, and some are less. However, it's also depends on relationships and the perceived competitiveness or cooperativeness of others. Under competitive conditions men will play their cards much closer to their chests, but where cooperation is required then openness is more favoured.
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It's about projecting strength. Show no weakness and people will think you're strong. Or at least, that's the thinking. But I find that exposing weakness can be a great strength in the long run as you make "allies" with others who might have similar weakness. The old saying is true, there's strength in numbers.
 
robert l. bentham said:
meh... but.... no... we are little more than the culmination of our genetics and life experiences ... to downplay one in order to favour the other i think is somewhat disingenuous,coming from you, i think; given your level of understanding about "stuff"in general...
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They are not equal contributors in all aspects. I don't think that increased emotional sharing in two generations is more chemical than cultural shift. I'm not entirely sure what position you are advocating.
 
redrumloa said:
No, it is not just cultural and the "emotional" aspect is actually only one aspect. The more troubling aspect is the physical one. Sperm counts are way, way down. Physical appearance is without a doubt changing.
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Sure, but I didn't see those things in this article.
 
FluffyMcDeath said:
Sure, but I didn't see those things in this article.
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That's why I put "continues". To be clear I don't think men having close relationships with friends and family is bad, but flowers and chocolates between guy friends is a bit eyebrow raising :eek:
 
Society has clearly changed. The US, 200 years ago was mostly an agriculture society, with some small manufacturing. We went through a period of mining, exploration, and increases in manufacturing. These are more closely tied to the 'hunter' roles associated with manliness. We're now in a service economy where things are about relationships. And we're seeing women's roles and wages equal mens's wages. The skillsets used today are clearly different than the skillsets used 100 years ago. Is there something in the water as Red contends? Perhaps but even so it's not the only factor at play. (And clearly my well water at home doesn't have the fluoride and other chemicals injected into the town's water supply, along with a 3 stage reverse osmosis filter that claims to remove about 99.9% of chemicals.)

As for flowers and chocolates - give whatever you want who cares? Are flowers between guys to feminine for you to over come in your male ego? Then don't do it. ... Personally, I've never given guys flowers. Though it's because most of them don't like flowers and instead I give something that more suits their personal interest. If they loved flowers I wouldn't be above that sort of gift, nor do would I feel less manly for it.
 
To be clear I don't think men having close relationships with friends and family is bad, but flowers and chocolates between guy friends is a bit eyebrow raising
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Well, if you removed the cultural stigma of chocolates and flowers.... Is it really that much different from a couple beers and tickets to the game?
 
faethor said:
Is there something in the water as Red contends?
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I'd imagine there was a lot more in the water back in the mining and manufacturing years than there is now. Back then they were completely clueless, making cans out of lead and using mercury like it was harmless, amongst many other things. Heck, I still remember seeing leaded gasoline at the gas pumps, that wasn't THAT long ago.

I think some people romanticize the past and like to pretend that the air was pure and the food was healthy and men were men and women were women.
 
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