Average Candian is richer than the Average American

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Shoulda used a picture of Wozniak, Jobs wasn't much of an engineer. He was just a big cry baby that is most famous for stealing ideas from Xerox labs. I guess Obama would be correct to say he didn't build that.
 
what have the fake republicans made.....oh, nothing
 
Shoulda used a picture of Wozniak, Jobs wasn't much of an engineer. He was just a big cry baby that is most famous for stealing ideas from Xerox labs. I guess Obama would be correct to say he didn't build that.
Woz build the Apple II. I believe the pictured computer is a MacIntosh. In 81, when Jobs turned his attention to the Mac, Woz crashed his small computer plane. Woz was the beginning of a long 2 year recovery before he returned to Apple.

Not surprisingly Jobs didn't build this stuff himself (just as Obama stated :rolleyes:)
 
Shoulda used a picture of Wozniak, Jobs wasn't much of an engineer. He was just a big cry baby that is most famous for stealing ideas from Xerox labs. I guess Obama would be correct to say he didn't build that.
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Xerox was giving away the ideas, and they had LOTS of good ones, however they considered themselves a copier company and refused to branch out into other products.
Jobs was brilliant at recognizing what features the customer would value and pay a premium for.
Business ideas are a dime a dozen, to make them work requires an investment of your own blood, sweat, and $$$
 
Most entrepreneurs go bankrupt and the successful ones go bankrupt several times. What they tend to learn from this that remains a mystery to most people is that defaulting on the investment that other people have made in you generally doesn't cost that much. Borrow 10 million, lose your house and car. Borrow another 10 million till, get another house and car and try again till you make it.

You're describing cronyism. You give Obama a large campaign contribution, Obama has the DOE give your "green energy" company a $500 million loan, then you go bankrupt. also known as the "Chicago Way". Another version is after your elected state senator, your wife gets a do nothing job at a local hospital, then the Hospital receives "community grants" in legislation you sponsor.

Banks don't loan to startups, startups require equity investments
 
Wow is your butt jealous of the shit your mouth spews?
Is that why you keep your head up your arse? :finger:

The workers take a huge risk. Often the man was the sole bread winner for the family. Many had other jobs they left to dedicate their own sweat to work on the vision of others. If that vision failed the workers suffer too as they often lost their employment which means they couldn't pay for homes or feed kids. A great example of this is the depression era. In your view of the world it'd only be the visionairies which went homeless and breadless in the Depression. We all know that's not the truth. It's more often than not the workers that suffer as they absorb the risks.

They're not indentured servants, they're free to find another job at any time

If the employer hires the wrong workers the business could fail, an employer takes a risk everytime he hires someone
 
They're not indentured servants, they're free to find another job at any time
As is anyone, including the investors.
If the employer hires the wrong workers the business could fail, an employer takes a risk everytime he hires someone
If the employee works for the wrong employer, whose business could fail, the employee takes a risk everytime he works for someone. ... In short it's a complete failure to believe ALL risk is only on the owner. A company is a group of many people and each one has risk. The difference is in degrees.
 
Xerox was giving away the ideas, and they had LOTS of good ones, however they considered themselves a copier company and refused to branch out into other products.
OK. But then the idea came from Xerox, not Jobs. Jobs saw the usefulness of another person's idea. Jobs was able to copy that other person's idea without paying for it. This reduced Jobs risk. However, Jobs applied this idea to the Mac which was a computer that Jobs didn't make. Another group of people made it. And that group applied the GUI. Jobs didn't. Jobs just told them to do it.

Jobs was brilliant at recognizing what features the customer would value and pay a premium for
Business ideas are a dime a dozen, to make them work requires an investment of your own blood, sweat, and $$$
Businesses also require the blood, sweat and labor of groups of individuals. If they don't have $ to invest they invest their labor and risk their families welfare. Especially when you're talking going to a Start Up instead of an established business.

As for the latest pic...the iPhone it wasn't Jobs that built that either. Jobs told his group to investigate touchscreen technology and combine it with computing. The original Apple Phone design was from Hartmut Esslinger. You need to read some Apple History. There's a number of books on Jobs and his relationship with employees, especially engineering. Jobs certainly had ideas on how he wanted products. Though he gave Engineering teams to come up with ideas then he demanded engineering tweaks for the marketplace. Nor did he manufacture them himself. The latest iPads, etc. come from FoxConn who, like Apple, is a GROUP, not an individual.
 
As is anyone, including the investors.
If the employee works for the wrong employer, whose business could fail, the employee takes a risk everytime he works for someone. ... In short it's a complete failure to believe ALL risk is only on the owner. A company is a group of many people and each one has risk. The difference is in degrees.

If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together. There are some things, just like fighting fires, we don’t do on our own. I mean, imagine if everybody had their own fire service. That would be a hard way to organize fighting fires.

American enterprise, rests on people who are willing to take a risk, and people that risk it all, often LOSE.

13-year-old entrepreneur told "no hot dog sales"

The false assumption your making is that the successful were guaranteed to be so, by a helpful government. But that’s not how things it works in the real world. Most business ventures fail, and not for a lack of roads and bureaucrats. The bureaucratic burden is a very heavy burden on a small business.

Obama wants to say you didn’t really earn what you earned? They want you to hand it over because they believe the public owns part of it? Who shares the downside with you, when you lose your ass? Does the public own part of failure, too? The government lets you own some percentage of the success, and all the failure. Heads they win, tails you lose.

Business risk backed by the government is cronyism. When bureaucrats interject politics in business decisions, and buy into things that no sane investor would. When the government is involved the result is always graft, vote-buying, and cronyism.

There is no difference between Obama's and a gangster's arguments on why businesses owe them protection money
 
OK. But then the idea came from Xerox, not Jobs. Jobs saw the usefulness of another person's idea. Jobs was able to copy that other person's idea without paying for it. This reduced Jobs risk. However, Jobs applied this idea to the Mac which was a computer that Jobs didn't make. Another group of people made it. And that group applied the GUI. Jobs didn't. Jobs just told them to do it.

'Jobs just told them to do it."
:rolleyes:
 
What the heck is all this bullcrapping "you didn't build that" about?
it's meaningless garbage. the basic idea is expressed perfectly by Elizabeth Warren here


the ideas are simply being "karl roverized" - ie. twisted to not have their original meaning. and, of course, anything that Obama says must be Demonized simply because he said it or supports it.
 
it's meaningless garbage. the basic idea is expressed perfectly by Elizabeth Warren here


the ideas are simply being "karl roverized" - ie. twisted to not have their original meaning. and, of course, anything that Obama says must be Demonized simply because he said it or supports it.
Wow, not a sentence wasted :)
 
the ideas are simply being "karl roverized" - ie. twisted to not have their original meaning. and, of course, anything that Obama says must be Demonized simply because he said it or supports it.

She who is Whiter than Snow With High Cheekbones and Pow Wow Cookbook said:
There is nobody in this country who got rich on his own. Nobody. You built a factory out there — good for you! But I want to be clear. You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for. You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate. You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for. You didn’t have to worry that marauding bands would come and seize everything at your factory, and hire someone to protect against this, because of the work the rest of us did. Now look, you built a factory and it turned into something terrific, or a great idea — God bless. Keep a big hunk of it. But part of the underlying social contract is you take a hunk of that and pay forward for the next kid who comes along.
Argument made by Obama and Warren:
There are some government activities that benefit us all, including business owners.
the federal government is the best, most efficient and only possible supplier of these benefits.

What are the exact government programs and projects that Obama and Warren use to justify their position:

Education
Obama: “There was a great teacher somewhere in your life.”
Warren: “You hired workers the rest of us paid to educate.”
Transportation
Obama: “Somebody invested in roads and bridges.”
Warren: “You moved your goods to market on the roads the rest of us paid for.”
Public Safety
Warren: “You were safe in your factory because of police forces and fire forces that the rest of us paid for.”
Obama: “There are some things, just like fighting fires, we don’t do on our own.”
The Internet
Obama: “Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.”

What percentage of the federal budget is devoted to these universally beneficial public works?

Being as generous as possible to the "progressive position" I will include ALL of defense spending, since defense aids both basic research and public safety. Highways and roads are covered by the Department of Transportation. The Department of Education and other smaller departments — Department of Justice, National Science Foundation, etc. — also contribute in varying degrees to public safety, research, and education
Department of Defense 18.74%
Department of Transportation 2.05%
Department of Education 1.32%
Department of Homeland Security 1.21%
Department of Justice 0.67%
National Science Foundation 0.20%
TOTAL: 23.4%
So what Obama and Warren are really stating is this:
Only one-fourth of your federal tax dollars go to projects and programs that benefit the general public and entrepreneurs; the other three-fourths are essentially a complete waste.

Obama and Warren have intentionally conflated local taxes with federal taxes. Public education, police and firefighters, and street repair are primarily paid for by property taxes, local sales taxes, and state taxes. Federal grants can supplement local funds, but rarely is a school district or a police department funded entirely with federal money.

So Obama and Warren are making an argument for increased local taxes. not a rationale for increased federal taxes.

 
Good video. I'd say watch about 1:10-1:40 which is the section before what you cited. It's very clear that Obama is talking about that we're a society. No man is an island which did it on their own.

American enterprise, rests on people who are willing to take a risk, and people that risk it all, often LOSE.
For example: not only Steve Jobs but the Engineering teams which built the Mac and the iPhone in the picture. So yes it is correct that Jobs did not build that on his own. He had help and a group which risked their own families and life to accomplish it.

The false assumption your making is that the successful were guaranteed to be so, by a helpful government.
Go back and read what I wrote. Not once did I say it was the government. I talked about the groups of workers that themselves brought the sweat on their brows and ideas in their heads which in turn aided people like Jobs to be successful.

Obama wants to say you didn’t really earn what you earned?
No he doesn't. It's what the right-wing talking heads want you to believe he said. What he's saying is 'We the People' formed together to make this Country great.

'Jobs just told them to do it."
So clearly Jobs - 'didn't get their on (his) own'. He had help some great minds behind him that designed the hardware and pulled together the software making them all work together to create a product.[/quote]
 
What he's saying is 'We the People' formed together to make this Country great.
ding ding ding.

there's so many great projects that Americans do all the time - they never get airtime because working hard and accomplishing something isn't as sexy as killing a bunch of people. My point is that for these fake republicans this concept seems completely out of their understanding.

in the beginning of my freelance career I worked alone. Then I began to work on commercials, films and so on. At first i wasn't sure I would be able to do it, but I realized that I certainly WAS a team player. That what mattered was the job and doing it well. The rovians think this is 'socialism'.

I think it's American.
 
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