Colder winter or warmer? fear mongers -vs- old timer voodoo

[metalman]

Re: Colder winter or warmer? fear mongers -vs- old timer voo

We are currently languishing at a solar minimum. Solar output has fallen in each of the last 5 years. This is a normal part of the sunspot cycle. We SHOULD have been cooling for the last 5 years.

Unfortunately it seems that the new sunspot cycle isn't firing up very well and solar output may continue to sputter along at lower levels for some time.

If the cycle doesn't start up properly soon then we may have folks skating on the Thames again just like the Elizabethans did.

The Maunder Minimum of 1645-1715, coincided with the Little Ice Age.

as of August 28th, 2008, a total of 416 spotless days have occurred in the current minimum phase, and the 38th consecutive spotless day

If there is not a startup of sunspots in SC24 before 2009, comparisons to the Dalton minimum will become likely.

Based on the most recent data it looks like the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) has dropped from solar cycle 23’s peak of 1367 w/m^2 to 1365 w/m^2 which is a drop of 2 watts/m^2 over the surface of the planet.

 

[metalman]

Re: Colder winter or warmer? fear mongers -vs- old timer voo

We are currently languishing at a solar minimum. Solar output has fallen in each of the last 5 years. This is a normal part of the sunspot cycle. We SHOULD have been cooling for the last 5 years.

Unfortunately it seems that the new sunspot cycle isn't firing up very well and solar output may continue to sputter along at lower levels for some time.

If the cycle doesn't start up properly soon then we may have folks skating on the Thames again just like the Elizabethans did.

The Maunder Minimum of 1645-1715, coincided with the Little Ice Age.

as of August 28th, 2008, a total of 416 spotless days have occurred in the current minimum phase, and the 38th consecutive spotless day

If there is not a startup of sunspots in SC24 before 2009, comparisons to the Dalton minimum will become likely.

Based on the most recent data it looks like the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) has dropped from solar cycle 23’s peak of 1367 w/m^2 to 1365 w/m^2 which is a drop of 2 watts/m^2 over the surface of the planet.

 

[faethor]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

 

[faethor]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

 

[faethor]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

 

[faethor]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

 

[faethor]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

 

[faethor]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

 

[metalman]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Solar cycle 23 was officially declared over by NASA in March 2006. NASA forecasted that SC24 would be 20 to 50 per cent stronger than SC23. Since then (3) very small sunspots from SC24 have been sighted, as well as (17) sunspots from SC23 - scientists determine which spots belong to which cycle by their magnetic polarity.

A period similar to Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) will have spotless periods of 60 to 90 days duration.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.

 

[metalman]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Solar cycle 23 was officially declared over by NASA in March 2006. NASA forecasted that SC24 would be 20 to 50 per cent stronger than SC23. Since then (3) very small sunspots from SC24 have been sighted, as well as (17) sunspots from SC23 - scientists determine which spots belong to which cycle by their magnetic polarity.

A period similar to Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) will have spotless periods of 60 to 90 days duration.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.

 

[metalman]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Solar cycle 23 was officially declared over by NASA in March 2006. NASA forecasted that SC24 would be 20 to 50 per cent stronger than SC23. Since then (3) very small sunspots from SC24 have been sighted, as well as (17) sunspots from SC23 - scientists determine which spots belong to which cycle by their magnetic polarity.

A period similar to Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) will have spotless periods of 60 to 90 days duration.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.

 

[metalman]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Solar cycle 23 was officially declared over by NASA in March 2006. NASA forecasted that SC24 would be 20 to 50 per cent stronger than SC23. Since then (3) very small sunspots from SC24 have been sighted, as well as (17) sunspots from SC23 - scientists determine which spots belong to which cycle by their magnetic polarity.

A period similar to Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) will have spotless periods of 60 to 90 days duration.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.

 

[metalman]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Solar cycle 23 was officially declared over by NASA in March 2006. NASA forecasted that SC24 would be 20 to 50 per cent stronger than SC23. Since then (3) very small sunspots from SC24 have been sighted, as well as (17) sunspots from SC23 - scientists determine which spots belong to which cycle by their magnetic polarity.

A period similar to Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) will have spotless periods of 60 to 90 days duration.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.

 

[metalman]

95%+ of climatologies state that man has had influence into release of greenhouse gases which has had a climate changing impact to our planet. Also these climatologies do understand that man is not the sole factor in the change of climate but is still a factor.

Maunder Minimum is an interesting example. The Northern Hemisphere experiencing 2-4 degree coolder winters but the Southern Hemisphere appeared to have a slight warming effect. Work has been going on to understand this relationship and I think the current estimate is the solar inactivity somehow caused a switch in the magnetic field.

I doubt anyone completely discounts the Sun's effect if the darn thing were gone we'd all be in trouble. But, IF we are in a rebirth of the Maunder Minimum it'll be interesting to see if we can reach the colds of 400 years ago or if our colds will be warmer. The question of WHY would remain. It could be we're colder due to lack of sun activity but our cold is warmer then 400 years ago due to excess Greenhouse gases.

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Solar cycle 23 was officially declared over by NASA in March 2006. NASA forecasted that SC24 would be 20 to 50 per cent stronger than SC23. Since then (3) very small sunspots from SC24 have been sighted, as well as (17) sunspots from SC23 - scientists determine which spots belong to which cycle by their magnetic polarity.

A period similar to Dalton Minimum (1790 to 1830) will have spotless periods of 60 to 90 days duration.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.

 

[faethor]

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Okay. But the magentic change appears to have been on earth during this period. At least say some scientist's guesses -- they'll still researching this possibility.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.[/quote]
It's unfair to say controls. Earth, like other planets, has our unique compositions of gases within the atmosphere. The amount of solar impact on a body is determined by distance from the solar object, that's why Pluto's very cold and Mercury very warm. Also, the atmospheric conditions of the planet reflect and absorb solar radiation. While the atmosphere are the gases above the plantary material we have the planteary material itself as it can absorb and reflect solar radiation. The climate on the planet is indeed influenced by the Solar activity. However, saying solar activity controls earth climate isn't true as the planet itself and our distance are but 2 of the various factors. There are others -- magnetic fields of the planet help to reflect some solar radiation for example.

 

[faethor]

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Okay. But the magentic change appears to have been on earth during this period. At least say some scientist's guesses -- they'll still researching this possibility.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.[/quote]
It's unfair to say controls. Earth, like other planets, has our unique compositions of gases within the atmosphere. The amount of solar impact on a body is determined by distance from the solar object, that's why Pluto's very cold and Mercury very warm. Also, the atmospheric conditions of the planet reflect and absorb solar radiation. While the atmosphere are the gases above the plantary material we have the planteary material itself as it can absorb and reflect solar radiation. The climate on the planet is indeed influenced by the Solar activity. However, saying solar activity controls earth climate isn't true as the planet itself and our distance are but 2 of the various factors. There are others -- magnetic fields of the planet help to reflect some solar radiation for example.

 

[faethor]

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Okay. But the magentic change appears to have been on earth during this period. At least say some scientist's guesses -- they'll still researching this possibility.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.[/quote]
It's unfair to say controls. Earth, like other planets, has our unique compositions of gases within the atmosphere. The amount of solar impact on a body is determined by distance from the solar object, that's why Pluto's very cold and Mercury very warm. Also, the atmospheric conditions of the planet reflect and absorb solar radiation. While the atmosphere are the gases above the plantary material we have the planteary material itself as it can absorb and reflect solar radiation. The climate on the planet is indeed influenced by the Solar activity. However, saying solar activity controls earth climate isn't true as the planet itself and our distance are but 2 of the various factors. There are others -- magnetic fields of the planet help to reflect some solar radiation for example.

 

[faethor]

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Okay. But the magentic change appears to have been on earth during this period. At least say some scientist's guesses -- they'll still researching this possibility.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.[/quote]
It's unfair to say controls. Earth, like other planets, has our unique compositions of gases within the atmosphere. The amount of solar impact on a body is determined by distance from the solar object, that's why Pluto's very cold and Mercury very warm. Also, the atmospheric conditions of the planet reflect and absorb solar radiation. While the atmosphere are the gases above the plantary material we have the planteary material itself as it can absorb and reflect solar radiation. The climate on the planet is indeed influenced by the Solar activity. However, saying solar activity controls earth climate isn't true as the planet itself and our distance are but 2 of the various factors. There are others -- magnetic fields of the planet help to reflect some solar radiation for example.

 

[faethor]

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Okay. But the magentic change appears to have been on earth during this period. At least say some scientist's guesses -- they'll still researching this possibility.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.[/quote]
It's unfair to say controls. Earth, like other planets, has our unique compositions of gases within the atmosphere. The amount of solar impact on a body is determined by distance from the solar object, that's why Pluto's very cold and Mercury very warm. Also, the atmospheric conditions of the planet reflect and absorb solar radiation. While the atmosphere are the gases above the plantary material we have the planteary material itself as it can absorb and reflect solar radiation. The climate on the planet is indeed influenced by the Solar activity. However, saying solar activity controls earth climate isn't true as the planet itself and our distance are but 2 of the various factors. There are others -- magnetic fields of the planet help to reflect some solar radiation for example.

 

[faethor]

The magnetic polarity of the sun reverses every 11 year cycle.

Okay. But the magentic change appears to have been on earth during this period. At least say some scientist's guesses -- they'll still researching this possibility.

Solar activity controls the Earth's climate, the Total Solar Irradiance (TSI) varies.[/quote]
It's unfair to say controls. Earth, like other planets, has our unique compositions of gases within the atmosphere. The amount of solar impact on a body is determined by distance from the solar object, that's why Pluto's very cold and Mercury very warm. Also, the atmospheric conditions of the planet reflect and absorb solar radiation. While the atmosphere are the gases above the plantary material we have the planteary material itself as it can absorb and reflect solar radiation. The climate on the planet is indeed influenced by the Solar activity. However, saying solar activity controls earth climate isn't true as the planet itself and our distance are but 2 of the various factors. There are others -- magnetic fields of the planet help to reflect some solar radiation for example.